Gaile, a quick solution for the Storage PR outrage

[epyon96]

Since the discontent for most of the Guild Wars community seems to be with regards to fairness. And in an effort to be "fair", I don't like to even touch the second issue of "integrety" because it is far better to give the developers the benefit of doubt and assume that the feature is a content.

This discontent seems pretty big..lolz. Just look at the other threads. 77 and counting :P...

Why don't you just implement the feature only for those who own more then 1 chapter? It makes the most sense for us. And I considered it from your perspective, that makes the most sense financially too. This can set the precedent for future chapter combinations.

Say, 3 or more get even more storage, or some other bonus "core" feature.

I believe this solution alleviates a great deal of community grief.

EPYON

[newbieguyone]

You aren't addressing the real issue. People are upset because ANet promised in an old FF that all future interface/etc. updates would be applied to all chapters.

By setting this precedent with storage, people are upset because now they might have to purchase all future chapters if they want every interface update. In the past, people believed that you could buy one chapter (say GW:P) and never be obligated to buy future chapters. While this is still true, you now have to face the possibility that old chapters may no longer be supported in the future - meaning that in the worst case scenerio, you will HAVE to buy all future chapters to get updates.

That's the first step towards turning GW into a P2P game (I doubt it'll ever happen, but it could become *similar* to a P2P model). It's a small step in the wrong direction, but it's still a step. Not a big deal in itself, but the precedent it set is monumental.

[Isioviel]

Then there is the whole other point that the new storage space is limited to material stacks only... Which is useless to a decent percentage of players.

[ImSoToast]

I really think this is the root of the issue, the concern of this setting precedence. Maybe, if possible, it would help a lot if anet or gaile gave us a list of basic features, not basic, and such. There might be arguements about what category what is in, but if they say hey storage is not basic well than they did not lie. I think a list like this would really put an end to this "debate".

[epyon96]

You aren't addressing the real issue. People are upset because ANet promised in an old FF that all future interface/etc. updates would be applied to all chapters.

By setting this precedent with storage, people are upset because now they might have to purchase all future chapters if they want every interface update. In the past, people believed that you could buy one chapter (say GW:P) and never be obligated to buy future chapters. While this is still true, you now have to face the possibility that old chapters may no longer be supported in the future - meaning that in the worst case scenerio, you will HAVE to buy all future chapters to get updates.

That's the first step towards turning GW into a P2P game (I doubt it'll ever happen, but it could become *similar* to a P2P model). It's a small step in the wrong direction, but it's still a step. Not a big deal in itself, but the precedent it set is monumental.

Perhaps you didn't understand my solution but I was suggesting that since more characters in one account need more storage, address that.

If you own any combination of chapters totallinag 2, a storage enchancement, etc.

It's done mainly to address the issue of fairness to both sides. I know it doesn't touch on the "going back on their word" argument that some of you have. If you can let that go for a second and have a bit of faith in them, consider it as a solution for future implementations. It is a compromised solution but at least it seems more fair than the current "give more core features to faction owner" solution

[Servant of Kali]

OMG not another thread!

ANet promised basic features, UPGRADED storage is obviously not a basic feature. It's ADVANCED feature.

This discontent seems pretty big..lolz. Just look at the other threads. 77 and counting :P...

Yes and im one of those who posted there making it that long. I think what ANet does is good, i love it. Im also ok with your suggestions.

[epyon96]

OMG not another thread!



I guess this issue is just stimulates that type of outrage in the community for members like myself who rarely open threads to post:P.

EPYON

[MikesSmikes]

Since the discontent for most of the Guild Wars community seems to be with regards to fairness. And in an effort to be "fair", I don't like to even touch the second issue of "integrety" because it is far better to give the developers the benefit of doubt and assume that the feature is a content.

This discontent seems pretty big..lolz. Just look at the other threads. 77 and counting :P...

Why don't you just implement the feature only for those who own more then 1 chapter? It makes the most sense for us. And I considered it from your perspective, that makes the most sense financially too. This can set the precedent for future chapter combinations.

Say, 3 or more get even more storage, or some other bonus "core" feature.

I believe this solution alleviates a great deal of community grief.

EPYON

Yep it would make sense. i suggested it before actually. would have been a better "PR" move. but overall the whole storage thing is a pretty minor issue (in my eyes) anyways. they say it isn t a basic future. "the outraged players" say it is a basic feature. /chuckle... lol that s the essence of it.

and i don t think anything would curb the "outrage". i visit this board over a year now and "the outrage TM" is always there about one or another thing. if the "storage outrage" goes away then "the outrage TM" will look for another target, and in absence of a true pressing issue "create" idiotical issues out of thin air. We ll never get rid of "the outrage TM" i m afraid since it seems to be a selffueling phenomenon that quite often seems to be detached from reality.
Some people just like to feed "the outrage TM" it seems, even about minor issues or nonissues. It s like "the outrage TM" depends on these people just like these people depend on "the outrage TM" to be there to entertain them anytime they feel like it.

P.S. "the outrage TM" is not to be misunderstood as constructive critiscism, even when both quite often are aimed at the same topic. They are however quite different, and the later is always welcome, while the former is just pointless drivel no matter how you look at it. :rolleyes:

if one considers himself to be a constructive critiscist or "the outrage TM" troller, every poster has to know best for themselves, altough rude language, flames, extreme entitlemendedness (along the lines of "i gave you 50 bucks now you are my SLAVES for LIFETIME) and trolling the board with the same topic numerous times are a good indicator of being on the way to the ....dark side.:huh:

[epyon96]

Yep it would make sense. i suggested it before actually. would have been a better "PR" move. but overall the whole storage thing is a pretty minor issue (in my eyes) anyways. they say it isn t a basic future. "the outraged players" say it is a basic feature. /chuckle... lol that s the essence of it.

and i don t think anything would curb the "outrage". i visit this board over a year now and "the outrage TM" is always there about one or another thing. if the "storage outrage" goes away then "the outrage TM" will look for another target, and in absence of a true pressing issue "create" idiotical issues out of thin air. We ll never get rid of "the outrage TM" i m afraid since it seems to be a selffueling phenomenon that quite often seems to be detached from reality.
Some people just like to feed "the outrage TM" it seems, even about minor issues or nonissues. It s like "the outrage TM" depends on these people just like these people depend on "the outrage TM" to be there to entertain them anytime they feel like it.

P.S. "the outrage TM" is not to be misunderstood as constructive critiscism, even when both quite often are aimed at the same topic. They are however quite different, and the later is always welcome, while the former is just pointless drivel no matter how you look at it. :rolleyes:

There is a slight different in the extent of what's happened. In the past, the main outrage part was regarding the number of slots for combined accounts. No matter how I looked at it, 4+4 = 6 is boggus. But whatever, it passed. The reason why is this: we bought the game knowing that. Seeing how sales figures are published, it would seem Arenanet for the most part priced the game right despite that outrage.

Now the problem here is that we bought the game, which is not just a product but an ongoing service since it's all online. Now they are changing the conditions of the service without "our consent". It sounds funny to say I realize but the original premise was to have a game where core features will be free and no one chapter will give an core/fundamental advantage over owning other chapters. The extent of this issue I believe is minor. But it does set the precedent for the future when Arenanet wants to change more "conditions" of the service. That's what prompted most of this outrage.

EPYON

[MikesSmikes]

EPYON, and this one will pass too:rolleyes:

and if it doesn t. tell you what, if this "storage" non - issue (in my eyes) continues to be the most important hotly discussed complaint vs Arena-Net... then indeed they are doing something very very very right. :rolleyes:

remember, "the outrage TM" will always be there. it s rather when you look where "the outrage TM" focuses that you get an indicator of the overall quality of the game.... and again, if that "focus" for the most horrible pressing issue is about wether minor gimmiks will belong to this or that chapter.... then yeah that s a good indicator for Guildwars as a whole being a rock solid game.

People will always complain. That s like the first major law of society. The difference is that in the 3rd world they complain about being mistreated and starving to death while in the western countries some people complain just as vehemently when their coffee is too hot.

[epyon96]

EPYON, and this one will pass too:rolleyes:

and if it doesn t. tell you what, if this "storage" non - issue (in my eyes) continues to be the most important hotly discussed complaint vs Arena-Net... then indeed they are doing something very very very right. :rolleyes:

remember, "the outrage TM" will always be there. it s rather when you look where "the outrage TM" focuses that you get an indicator of the overall quality of the game.... and again, if that "focus" for the most horrible pressing issue is about wether minor gimmiks will belong to this or that chapter.... then yeah that s a good indicator for Guildwars as a whole being a rock solid game.

Since I can't fall asleep, I'll respond to this. There may always be outrage but very few of them will turn players away from buying the game. The 4+4 = 6 potentially would've but it didn't and it was proven by sales figures recently. Nerfs and buffs to certain skills certainly don't turn players away from the game. Access to certain areas of the game like elite missions often may turn players away but they are addressing it and the community seems to be content with the current "ferrying" alternative.

However, this type of hypocritical, (not my opinion necessarily) as viewed by the community, may turn players away from buying future chapters because you may not be able to buy what you pay for initially since the conditions of a contract changes. It's like if your life insurance company which you bought a plan for 1 million all of a sudden turns around and only pays 900k upon your death because they changed the contract even though you always made your payments. Perhaps not that drastic but same degree.



People will always complain. That s like the first major law of society. The difference is that in the 3rd world they complain about being mistreated and starving to death while in the western countries some people complain just as vehemently when their coffee is too hot.
This is irrelevent. The third world has no way of retaliating effectively. We do by simply not buying the next chapter. That's a huge differerence as a buyer.

EPYON

[MikesSmikes]

This is irrelevent. The third world has no way of retaliating effectively. We do by simply not buying the next chapter. That's a huge differerence as a buyer.

EPYON

oh it was meant as a comparison of the "importance" of complaints.

and having played online games since over 7 years, i can tell you, the game where a "gimmik on wich chapter" issue is the major complaint is indeed the best game out of all the ones i played before.... usually you have much more pressing issues like "class balance, über gear/mudflation, casual vs hardcore (raider) pvp, grind till your eyes bleed to get anywhere, frequent stability/network outtages, crash to desktop bugs... eh just pointing out, i tried the competition, and i certainly won t go back to the current competition and trade a "gimmik issue" for much more fundamental gamedesign issues that ruins my personal enjoyment of the game entirely :rolleyes:

of course that is my subjective opinion, but nevertheless how i feel and the basis of why i play this game and not another :rolleyes:

[Djinn Effer]

OP: You don't understand the problem, sorry.

It has nothing to do with storage, its the fact that they're doing something against their original promises.

Everyone: I'm not going to explain it further, if you can't grasp that then by all means continue arguing here. I'm sure it will get long quite fast with all of the other people that can't seem to understand that either.

[BastDawn]

Why don't you just implement the feature only for those who own more then 1 chapter? It makes the most sense for us. And I considered it from your perspective, that makes the most sense financially too. This can set the precedent for future chapter combinations.

So the solution to people complaining about Anet seeming to go back on their word is for them to do it again? They've already publicly said that owners of Factions would get the increased storage. As it stands, they can waffle about what is or is not a "core feature", but changing their minds now and denying increased storage to Factions-only players would undeniably be false advertising. It's too late for your suggestion.

[Alexia of Durham]

Then there is the whole other point that the new storage space is limited to material stacks only... Which is useless to a decent percentage of players.

There have been statements saying more storage -improvements could be forthcoming ( but then again: there have also been statements suggesting-at the very least- one wouldn't be required to own all chapters ;so we'll have to wait and see if any of this is true ). I for one would much rather see an enhancement of your actual inventory ( make things stackable in your bags more so weapon sets ,armor sets etc, would only occupy one slot instead of 5 ) .

[Findariel]

Another solution: make the normal storage 200 slots so the material box is just a unnecessary but fun luxury item ^^

[Lemonparty]

There are like 5 Prophecies-only people, so why bother...

[natasia]

You mean to get updates you might have to buy the most current version of a game? I can almost see why that would piss people off. No, wait, was something else. How is that different from anything else on the planet? Really? Prophecies was a blast, but playing it for around 9 months solid, and I flew into Factions as soon as it hit the shelves (had even preordered mine). I really can't understand why people are against checking out Factions. I'd even go as far to say that I'm getting chapter 3 on preorder if at all possible. I don't really expect Anet to keep pumping udates and support into the first chapter after its been out for a year. And yes, its pretty clear you have to buy the new titles to experience all the updates and whatnot. But then again, GW is NOT PtP. The only way they make their money is by the little $50 from each game sale. (And actually the retail stores sell it for $50, so Anet isn't even making that much for each game sold).

But back to my point. Its simple math. They aren't making money by charging each month. The guys that only own Prophecies are basically saying, "I'm not going to keep supporting Anet, I'm just going to take advantage of the Free to play feature." Dude, GW would actually be worth a monthly fee. I know, I tried a few minutes on WOW.

I say I understand only offering new features like expanded storage to the people that own the newest chapter, because I'd probably do the same sort of things in their shoes. Its business and Anet will take steps to drum up sales of future chapters. They have to. Its their only revenue and they have promised to keep GW free to play. So, instead of getting the reds of nothing at all. I've even seen plenty of posts by people saying that they might not get any more chapters because of issues like this. I say we all need to support Anet the only way we really can. By spending money. Thats how consumers help any company. If you like the game, enjoy playing the game, then buy what they're selling.

[Servant of Kali]

It has nothing to do with storage, its the fact that they're doing something against their original promises.

Everyone: I'm not going to explain it further, if you can't grasp that then by all means continue arguing here.

lol, you mean "if we cant grasp it"? And you're the one who cant grasp the difference between BASIC something and ADVANCED something.

I argumented my choice of words and NO ONE so far in this forum has managed to beat my argument.

No one.

What they did was bypass it n continue claiming whatever they claimed, but no one beat my argument. Neither did you. Now you question our ability to grasp, whereas it's you with the problems of grasping.


ANets promise: basic features.
Storage: basic feature.
Upgrade/special storage: ADVANCED feature.

Which part isnt clear?

Ok lemme reiterate :)

Can material storage self-exist? No, not really, it would make no sense. Ergo, it's not a basic feature. Check the dictionary for basic and advanced. I explained this much better in anotehr thread, im just too lazy to retype it all now.

EOD.

This is all i have to say on the subject.

[Alexia of Durham]

There are like 5 Prophecies-only people, so why bother...

this is untrue .I still see folks owning prophecies ONLY - I can tell because I got my ritualist and assasin in Tyria now - and even those having recently bought prohecies ( not factions ) .Besides : this sn't about the number of folks who will be affected by these decisions ,it's about an apparent change in policy .If the storage-improvements will be made available for CH 2 owners only , chances of this being the case for all other ,strictly non-technical , enhancements are very high.We might see trade improvements and those will be available for CH 3 owners ONLY etc.

It's about the principle and the policy ,not necessarily about this one issue .

[WingspanTT]

lol "outrage". And how exactly do you define outrage?

This forum represents maybe 5% or elss of the GW population, out of which how many are "outraged" over this?

I'm not saying it shoulnd't be changed, just that your word choice is inflammatory for no reason.

[Cyberman]

Can material storage self-exist? No, not really, it would make no sense.
Actually, why not?
For general purpose storage, we have pouches and such.
Had they never introduced the Xunlai agents as storage, they could just as well introduce a material-only storage, to free your inventory of them.

[StormAngel]

i think it depends on how you look at it from an individual perspective. i mean all chapters have the basic storage slots plus the slots their characters have. that could b seen as the basic bit while the new mat. storage could be seen as an added luxury that could b used as an incentive for people to buy a new chapter. this all comes down to what individuals think but the devs or whoever, seem to believe that the 'extra' storage is a luxury while the storage we have atm is basic 'core' storage.

my 2c

[COLDshiver]

i agree with the advanced and basic feature. The storage is there as a basic feature for everyone, any combination of chapters. Anet is going to give players more storage, that is more storage than what prophecies people have. It's not extra slots in your storage, it's storage for your mats. It's an advanced type of storage, it's not regular storage. So it should be for Factions only.

Think of it this way: Paying the 50g fee to Xunlai will get you storage. Serving Emperor Kisu will give you storage for your mats :)

[Propater]

hmmm....

The way I see things, storage looks more like service than "interface improvement." The rather peculiar business model implemented by GW tends to blur the distinctions between product, service, content and what-nots which can generate lots of frustration for the customers (and lots of greedy leeway for the company.)

Anyway, I have the feeling we will see chapter 3 come with armour storage, chap 4 with green items storage or what-have-you...

And I mean, why not? The only problem here would be that :

1) This wasnt stated at release: if storage is a feature of a product (Facions), it sounds weird for it to come after release (through the streaming update system, which adds to the general confusion and frustration.)

2) Prophecies looks like the a poor bargain since it doesnt offer this kind of service/feature.

But some people here claimed that Prophecies had much more content than Factions, so maybe this storage update is a move on Anet's part to make up for it.

</sarcasm>

[KaliMagdalene]

There are like 5 Prophecies-only people, so why bother...

Then I've grouped with all five on multiple occasions. I've lost count of the number of people I've met who do not have Prophecies yet (if ever).

[Djinn Effer]

lol, you mean "if we cant grasp it"? And you're the one who cant grasp the difference between BASIC something and ADVANCED something.

I argumented my choice of words and NO ONE so far in this forum has managed to beat my argument.

No one.

What they did was bypass it n continue claiming whatever they claimed, but no one beat my argument. Neither did you. Now you question our ability to grasp, whereas it's you with the problems of grasping.


ANets promise: basic features.
Storage: basic feature.
Upgrade/special storage: ADVANCED feature.

Which part isnt clear?

Ok lemme reiterate :)

Can material storage self-exist? No, not really, it would make no sense. Ergo, it's not a basic feature. Check the dictionary for basic and advanced. I explained this much better in anotehr thread, im just too lazy to retype it all now.

EOD.

This is all i have to say on the subject.

You should really proof-read what you type, it would make some of your sentences sound less out of place.

Let me point out something for you:

http://forums.gwonline.net/showpost.php?p=4227243&postcount=782
http://forums.gwonline.net/showpost.php?p=4227316&postcount=787

Read those, disprove it then alright I'll believe you. Try to avoid personal attacks in the future, eh? Its rude, and doesn't really make your argument any more convincing. (Wait.. You had an argument?!) :laughing:

[matbar]

I understand what everyone is saying about basic and advance game feature and the storage is a non-event, its people just wanting something because someone else has it "grass is greener on the other side".

Storage - I was fine with storage in chapter 1 now with more armour and more "greens" I need extra space, material slot goes some way to add extra space.

At the end of the day Anet designed Prophecies with all traders, NPC, skill etc they gave are fine for Prophecies like storage space, but come Faction's we need more space (and a few more thing besides) its as simply as that - its just something they should of added with the new game to start with....

Those people who just brought Prophecies good for you, keep playing and enjoy but i've beening playing for 10 months now and completed the game and all the missions/tasks and explored everywhere I can go its time to move on - most games get stale after 6 months this one did not but its time to move on.

Brought Factions for £17.99 its not that expensive, I should get more for my money - The only thing I think Prophecies players should get at any "Global festival events" - let all plays for all chaptor compete in say "winterdays events" etc regardless of which world theyare in and any game instability updates thats it, if they want more go buy the new version.

[lifeinthefridge]

OMG not another thread!

ANet promised basic features, UPGRADED storage is obviously not a basic feature. It's ADVANCED feature.



Yes and im one of those who posted there making it that long. I think what ANet does is good, i love it. Im also ok with your suggestions.


You seem to forget that this thing did not come out with factions and is just a cheap pun to get more people to buy it. Listen to this

http://media.putfile.com/JeffStrain-Content-Bucket-Qoaute

Observer mode was free...