Rebirth... why the hype?

[Daruma Sureshot]

Hail and well met, all,

I've read on several different Monk boards around the Web that Rebirth is the best rez to use for PvE.

I have to wonder why?

Here's how I understand the power:

Brings rezzed person to your location... Good thing.

Costs 10 Energy... <shrugs> so so thing.

Disables rezzed person's skills for 4 to 10 seconds... BAD thing.

Drains ALL of your remaining energy, (so much for only 10 energy cost)... bad Bad BAd BAD thing !!!

WHY do I want to use a rezz that will drain all my remaining energy??

Certainly don't want to do it in combat since then I can't heal anyone while I wait for energy to come back. Not to mention that they are essentially out of the fight for 4 to 10 seconds 'til their skills can be used again.

If I've got more than one person to rez after combat it'll take awhile to keep regening the energy for each rez.

So, what am I missing?

Thanks all for you help with this mystery

Take care,
Balthas Soulstorm, Monk/Nec nOoB Extraordinaire
Proud Member Of
Odin's Hammer

[XeroTheta]

I would say simply the fact that you can teleport your buddy all the way across the map (I dunno if it has a range), away from the fray is the biggest help. Especially in PvE, this would mean that the priest could run far far away from any red mob and just cast it, brining the dead person back to life and letting them recharge their health away from the mobs.

More often than not, your body will die among a horde of enemies (unless there is a party wipe) but if you have a good monk, generally they will be far enough away from the action (trying to heal of course) to run away if things go sour. This way, he can just teleport rez everyone and you guys can go back and tackle those monsters without your monk dying :happy34: .

in PvP I dunno, the arenas are kinda small, but I can see it working if they get far enough away from their enemies so they have time to recover their energy loss.

This is all simply speculation. I have neither read up on this skill, nor played a monk, ever... but from the skill description, this is what I came up with. Hope this helps :happy34:

[He Hate Me]

you can rez your party without dying/them dying again. (good thing)

when your an hour and a half into fissure or something, the extra second and a half to regain the 10 energy doesnt seem like a big deal if your saving the mission.

[smitingmonk]

Disables rezzed person's skills for 4 to 10 seconds... BAD thing.

Drains ALL of your remaining energy, (so much for only 10 energy cost)... bad Bad BAd BAD thing !!!


1. the skills are disabled for 10-4 seconds depending on the level you have in protection prayers (good thing)

2. if you use rebirth when you only have 10 energy left its good but if you use it when you are on full energy thats bad

[smitingmonk]

1. the skills are disabled for 10-4 seconds depending on the level you have in protection prayers (good thing)

2. if you use rebirth when you only have 10 energy left its good but if you use it when you are on full energy thats bad


1. the skills are disabled for 10-4 seconds depending on the level you have in protection prayers (good & bad thing) bad is that they are diasabled

if you play a protection monk and max protection prayers the skills will only be disabled for 4 seconds. if you get like 16 in protection prayers the skills will be desabled for 0 seconds. i got that result when mixing with a character build with the edge.

[Metagenki]

So, what am I missing?

Nothing. Monks need to stop using it.

I'm pretty sure the range is the same as res and most every other spell.

If you're a real monk they won't be dying right after you res anyways, because you'll use the energy you still have from not using rebirth to heal them.

It has been useful as a ranger, though. Since you can't heal them and fight from a distance anyways, you can pull them back to you, and your energy is much more expendable. Not to mention it only takes 6 seconds instead of 8.

I generally prefer restore life, but it never works out when I run in as a ranger for a melee res.

[Celecar]

I prefer Restore Life for sure, but it's extremely seldom that I actually have it memmed, as someone in the group more or less needs to have Rebirth, just to be able to continue from near wipes in bad spots. And I cant rely on someone else in the group having it, so better just bring it myself.

[jlowry]

[QUOTE=Metagenki]Nothing. Monks need to stop using it.

I'm pretty sure the range is the same as res and most every other spell.

If you're a real monk they won't be dying right after you res anyways, because you'll use the energy you still have from not using rebirth to heal them.

[SNIP]
QUOTE]

If you res a party member that has fallen within a mob without teleporting them to you, they...

1. suck up all your energy to just die again (by your logic, if "you're a real monk" they wouldn't have died in the first place...sometimes death is unavoidable due to both mana pool limitations, numbers of party members, and the strength of the foes your group may have attempted to tackle)
2. sometimes cannot run away far enough from the mob before they die a second time...and incur a higher death penalty (if they can run away, great....you can res the rest due to their sacrifice)
3. sometimes get so confused due to the camera angles changing upon res that they run near you drawing the mob into a worse area...and you into possible aggro danger

Yes, rebirth has its consequences, but the benefits are not ignorable either. As with any skill you decide to use in Guild Wars, it all depends on the circumstance as to how effective it will be (and if the consequences are worth it).

[Celecar]

On a side note, Restore Life is more of a combat res, due to the benefits it has, and frankly, I seldom have time to care about resses during combat anyway, I am buzy healing...

[Corrodias]

let me give you an example of a situation in which it was useful to me:

1) most of the party dies while fighting a group, which is now down to 3. i run away as the last henchman stays to die.

2) i come back and resurrect all but two people using rebirth.

3) we attack and kill the rest of the enemies.

4) i res the last couple of people.

5) we continue onward.

in normal pve, this can save you some running. in a place like the underworld, it can save your ***.

the advantage of rebirth is that you can res people and get them away from the enemies so that you can attack again... AS A GROUP. using Resurrection means you attack again as a single half-dead person and a monk.

[Hart]

Whether in PvP or late game PvE, everyone should be carrying a Signet of Ressurection if they're not a Monk. Your monk shouldn't be your primary rezzer; when someone dies in combat that's an indication that the monk needs to focus on preventing someone else from dying right now and doesn't have the 6-8 seconds it's going to take to cast a rez. As a monk, it doesn't make a LOT of differance which rez you carry because the main use should be putting teammates back together after a hard fight so rez signets don't get wasted; Rebirth provides the additional flexibility of rezzing people who got a little too close to the next pack of baddies.

If you're a Monk subclass don't take Rebirth. You're the guy who's supposed to be rezzing DURING the fight; get Vengance if you can, or Restore Life. Spending 6 seconds to rez someone only to have them out of the battle for 10 seconds basically means it's 16 seconds until they're useful, and you burn up all your energy doing it. On the other hand, Vengance is 4 seconds and the target has full HP and MP. As a monk, this is GREAT because if I die it's probably because I'm out of juice; a full blue bar means lots of survivability for the group and the 30 second timer is long enough for most battles to begin and end.

I guess the distinction is which rez is best in combat, and which is best out of combat; in combat I would say the order is something like Vengance, Unyielding Aura, Signet, Restore Life, Ressurrect, Rebirth and out of combat just the opposite.

[hahnsoo]

Rebirth is HORRIBLE to use in Combat, as it puts the Monk out of the action (by draining all of the energy) and delays the effectiveness of the target (by freezing skills for several seconds).

However on a mission, I always bring Rebirth. Because I'm a Ranger/Monk, and because of Whirling Defense and Lightning Reflexes, I tend to stay alive the longest when the brown stuff hits the fan. Rebirth is the difference between a Total Party Kill on a mission and everyone being rezzed and ready to go. It's a great rez skill for a non-Primary Monk who is not a Primary healer as well.

For PvP, there's little to no reason to bring Rebirth. Restore Life is a much better option.

[Zijupino]

At first, when i got Rebirth and read the text, i had the same feeling as you guys, I mean disabled for 4-10 seconds, that's bad.

But after using it first hand, I found out that this is a really cool rez, as it saved our lives, from starting the mission all over again, a number of times. Usually I carry both Rebirth and Resurrection Signet on me, in during combat i use the signet. If more than 1 die simultaneously during a battle, it's clear that i'm in deep trouble and am not able to heal every1 in time due to overwhelming foes, this usually happens when i end up the only monk primary in a group of 6.

Rebirth is useful in these circumstances as i run for safety and then res the rest of the party to safety, instead of in the middle of the fray which will end up with a greater DP%.

Of course i do agree that in PvP there are better solution to rezing than Rebirth, though here it is not a total failure either.

As also mentioned, don't forget that the monk should not be the primary to res, since he is in a busier situation healing, though he should carry a couple in case of emergency, and in this case Rebirth fits the job perfectly.

[Feynt]

I too would advise against healers from using Rebirth. It has few applications in combat. However for monk secondaries (excluding N/Mo, as they are often healers too) I would recommend it because your energy is expendable. In almost every instance you can spend your energy except for that 10 to cast Rebirth in a few seconds (elementalists especially, with 25 energy spells).

Resurrection or Restore Life are just not options when most of the party falls in places like the underworld where monsters can do upwards of 200 damage a hit (many times the amount of health most people res with using either spell).

[Torm Shadowbane]

Simply put you don't resurrect during combat. I generally discourage it and as a Monk I would *NEVER* do it unless it was Vengeance. Why? Because I'm too busy keeping the party alive. Rebirth is used to resurrect after a near party wipe or a complete party wipe and it means your corpse is laying near hostile mobs. Rebirth is a life saver.

Could you use Resurrect? Sure. Rebirth has the same distance as Resurrect. HOWEVER, you lose the ability to teleport the person you ressed to safety. I could as a Monk use Resurrect on someone, slap a heal and a breeze on them, and then have everyone run away from the monsters as they once again begin their chase.

On my Warrior / Monk I ALWAYS bring Rebirth. In PvE Rebirth is essential. In PvP it's... well... not as useful. Generally speaking I don't like people using Rebirth in PvP because of the downsides and the fact a player doesn't care if you aren't in their danger zone or not. If you appear on their mini-map and are an enemy they are coming for you. (And I've actually had people use Rebirth on me in PvP, bringing me right into the middle of combat only to die again.)

In PvE Rebirth is irreplaceable. It doesn't take but about 30-40 seconds for me to go from zero energy to full if that long. That time after resurrecting the fallen (and normally as a Monk I'd leave it to someone with Monk secondary but on my Warrior I do it), is normally spent forming a strategy and talking about what went wrong.

[Darc.Syde]

as mentioned by other posts, the fact that it avoids agro is why it's the best rez for pve. so what you gotta stop for 10 seconds, stop...

[Sir Arthcos]

I usually take both Rebirth and Restore Life with me. Rebirth is awesome if most of your party is dead and you need to rez them away from monsters. But I use Restore Life ANYTIME I can. Rebirth has it's ups and downs, but imo as an Energy Storage Monk, Restore life is the thing to use! :clap:

[Croix Rheymis]

To make a long story short, you can res an ally in the middle of a group of enemies without dying if you're the last one alive.

And all the other res skills require you to walk closely enough to the dead body that you'll pull every monster in the group that was able to kill your entire party, not just you.

[Metagenki]

I should just let this go, but...

If you res a party member that has fallen within a mob without teleporting them to you, they...

1. suck up all your energy to just die again (by your logic, if "you're a real monk" they wouldn't have died in the first place...sometimes death is unavoidable due to both mana pool limitations, numbers of party members, and the strength of the foes your group may have attempted to tackle)

Don't insult my logic when you completely fail to comprehend it. Never once did I say (or imply) that nobody ever dies on a real monk.

[Obannon]

Wow. I might be the only person who uses Light of Dwyana. =O

[Aidan Gawain]

WHY do I want to use a rezz that will drain all my remaining energy??

Certainly don't want to do it in combat since then I can't heal anyone while I wait for energy to come back. Not to mention that they are essentially out of the fight for 4 to 10 seconds 'til their skills can be used again.
It's not for use in battle. It's in case you're in a losing battle and flee, but some allies don't make it. You can rez the dead allies without having to go back to the enemies you were fighting. You can then wait for energy to regen, skills to recharge, etc., and go back to the enemies that killed you later (or avoid them entirely). Sure, it's slow, but at the higher levels you can't afford to rush.

Right now, for example, I'm considering bringing Vengeance (for in-battle) and Rebirth (for post-battle).

[jlowry]

I should just let this go, but...


Don't insult my logic when you completely fail to comprehend it. Never once did I say (or imply) that nobody ever dies on a real monk.

My statement was not directed to you personally or to anything you've said...but what others say about monks WAY too often. It seems that most people refuse to play this game without total reliance on monks to perform constant miracles with only a modest energy pool. I'm sick of hearing people tell me (when I play my monk) how to do my job. When they complain, I might as well tell them to kill quicker and learn how to tank longer. Since when is this game based on how good back any single character is?!!?

If you want blamed for everything that goes wrong in GW, play a monk... Within a few missions, you'll see what I mean....as soon as an idiot aggros too many Hydras and ends up running for his life....or dying!

[jlowry]

So far I've seen many arguements for and against Rebirth...especially when combat is concerned.

For me, using rebirth in combat is not such a bad idea if you can load up the rest of your team with positive regen and find a nice spot behind a door/rock to rebirth them to. That way, they have a safe place to recoup while I get back to healing the others. Of course, it always helps to announce that's what I'm doing so that any other healer/monk secondary/protector knows how to handle themselves for the next 10 seconds.

Yes, my Energy is drained by rebirth....but most likely by the time the person died and I was able to get everyone else safe, I was low anyway. As long as I can get the rest healed with a posative regen working, resing the falling comrad to help with the fight (once they recoup) has so far worked out quite well.....in most cases. Rebirthing them to a safe spot has also helped reduce unnecessary DP. If I cannot keep the party safe long enough to use rebirth and regen enough for spot healing, I obviously wait for the end of the fight. Regardless, I like the benefit of choosing where the person gets ressurrected....instead of at the foot of the beast that killed them originally.

In the end, we all must admit that there are pros and cons to all these choices....thus the beauty of the balance incorporated within Guild Wars. No one has any right to tell any of us that a skill is worthless due to opinion.