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Laeryn Whitestorm
01-06-2005, 10:17
Not to add to the "I'm new to GW help make me l33t plzzz!" threads, but I was hoping to get some help. My 14 Me/E seems to do great in PvE but I very rarely do better than fair in an arena match. I have:
6 Fast Cast
8+1 Dom
4 Insp
4 Ill

My bar has:
Empathy
Backfire
Ether Feast
Diversion
Conjure Phantasm
Power Spike
Energy Burn
Res Sig

I only recently got to Yak's Bend so my problem might just be missing the more powerful spells. Anyway, my goal when I started was to be pretty much anti-caster, but I struggle taking down opposing monks. Backfire works great in PvE but is it worthwhile in PvP with its short duration and heavy energy cost? What's more, Orison and other low level monk heals have such fast cast times that they're extremely difficult to interrupt (or I really need to work on my timing). I try to use Backfire and Phantasm to keep the damage coming and then use the interrupts when they try to heal. Pretty soon I'm out of energy. Am I doing something totally wrong here? Thanks.

Laeryn Whitestorm

FowerFighter
01-06-2005, 10:45
You could use inspration for energy, for example switching powerspike with power drain will get ya 15 energy each interrupt if I remember correct

Saikyo
01-06-2005, 11:27
I'm not sure empathy really fits in there if you are going anti-caster. Backfire is a good spell even though it only lasts 10 seconds. And with 9 points in domination I imagine it would do a decent amount of damage.

I think you are spreading your points too thin between inspiration and illusion though. With only 4 points in illusion conjure phantasm isn't going to last long enough to put the pressure on the monks to heal themselves. Not only that but with only 4 points in inspiration I'm not sure if you are going to get enough health back when you use ether feast. If you have energy tap, consider putting that one in.

I agree with FowerFighter about adding more into inspiration magic though, it would help a lot with the energy. As for interrupts, if you are having problems interrupting the spells is to try and wait for one which you know has a long casting time. Interrupting a ressurect is a really good way to screw over an enemy monk (and it's REALLY easy). Heal Party is also a pretty common spell with a longer than 1 second casting time I believe.

If you put enough points into backfire, you won't HAVE to interrupt the orisons because they will take more damage than they heal.

Also if they spam orison too much try using distraction instead of trying to interrupt. That will force them to use another healing spell (which could have a longer casting time).

That's my 2 cents.

Nobleman Azure
01-06-2005, 12:48
Not to add to the "I'm new to GW help make me l33t plzzz!" threads, but I was hoping to get some help. My 14 Me/E seems to do great in PvE but I very rarely do better than fair in an arena match. I have:
6 Fast Cast
8+1 Dom
4 Insp
4 Ill

My bar has:
Empathy
Backfire
Ether Feast
Diversion
Conjure Phantasm
Power Spike
Energy Burn
Res Sig

I only recently got to Yak's Bend so my problem might just be missing the more powerful spells. Anyway, my goal when I started was to be pretty much anti-caster, but I struggle taking down opposing monks. Backfire works great in PvE but is it worthwhile in PvP with its short duration and heavy energy cost? What's more, Orison and other low level monk heals have such fast cast times that they're extremely difficult to interrupt (or I really need to work on my timing). I try to use Backfire and Phantasm to keep the damage coming and then use the interrupts when they try to heal. Pretty soon I'm out of energy. Am I doing something totally wrong here? Thanks.

Laeryn Whitestorm


Choose one, anti caster or anti warrior. Sinc eyour build leans to anti caster lets do that.

Lose the illusion tree, focus on inspiration because you NEED the energy. There are skills that crap up monk heal such as Shame (im sleepy, i might be wrong and its guilt instead)

Anyways Empathy, soon enough it will be of little use because of its low damage output.

Once you put more pts in inspiration Energy tap is a good way to regain energy for now.

My advice is not to mind PVP until you are able to do 8v8 tournament in tombs. 4v4 is nothing but a diversion to take your minds off the monsters for now. 4v4 is basically who gets or creates a team that luckily specially made against another team, that and "the team with 2 monks will eitehr win or annoy the hell out of you" type of match. 8v8 is where true skill is shown, so just proceed with PVE for now without PVP worries.

Laeryn Whitestorm
01-06-2005, 22:06
Thanks for the help all.. should I really lose Empathy though? I would like to be anti-caster, but in PvE that doesn't seem terribly practical. I usually play with a W/N buddy and when he uses bleeding and whatever skills and I use Empathy and Phantasm we take down just about any melee we've faced really fast. Inspiration points will help Energy Tap, but max is +13 energy with a 5 energy cost = 8 net energy. With a cast time of 3 seconds and a recharge of 20 seconds... I'm just not sure its efficient. Power Drain would be great, but I don't have it. :( I guess my problem is that I don't have the strong Inspiration spells to justify pumping Insp up to 6 or 7 just yet, and losing the Illusion points pretty much takes Phantasm out of the picture. Pretty much my entire bar is Domination, excepting Ether Feast and Phantasm. I guess the quest is on for those stronger spells...

Saikyo
01-06-2005, 23:51
Thanks for the help all.. should I really lose Empathy though? I would like to be anti-caster, but in PvE that doesn't seem terribly practical.

In PvE, damage output seems to be more important a lot of times since you don't always run into a lot of casters. (Though when you do it becomes invaluable.) The suggestions I was making were more for a PvP build where empathy isn't really as useful. I think you'll also find that as you get further into the PvE game that empathy is harder to use to kill monsters with. I switched empathy out for some smiting skills on my Me/Mo later on in the game since they can deal damage more directly.

If you are worried about damage, remember that your second class IS elementalist, and there are PLENTY of things from that class which can do the damage you are looking for. (Of course mesmers aren't really known for their high damage output in the first place.)

Also, don't think that one spell is "stonger" than another. Except for elite spells, any spell (any skill for that matter) has its own applications. All spells get better when you put more points into them. Energy tap is a really good spell if you can apply it properly since it also denies energy from the person you are casting it on as well as restoring your own energy. When you deny an enemy monk or elementalist 13 energy for their spell while at the same time gaining just enough for that extra backfire, its very worth it.

Tsume
01-06-2005, 23:58
Despite others comments, Empathy really isnt a bad skill.

A lot of people bash it saying things like 'Warriors get too much health later on for it to have any effect' or 'well the damage just gets healed up by the healers as soon as its delt'. Like healing only happens when Empathy damages someone now?..Missed that memo (and FYI if you spend energy which makes Healers spend energy, your still accomplishing something). Yah...30 damage an attack for 20 seconds isnt going to do any damage either, or so I'm told by some. Most warriors Attack through Empathy, becuase they are so confident in their damage and tanking abilities. Other (i.e. smarter) players will stop attacking...and wait for Empathy to wear off. And guess what...that means you just shut down that Mellee target.

Even in the Tombs it still has effect, as a team likes to use their Hex Shatters for hexes cast on their healers, and suprisingly, most Warriors still haven't learned better. (And don't try to tell me I'm wrong, I dont like to argue about it, just go talk to the Warriors that lay at my feet after thinking they can beat me becuase I'm such a defenseless Mesmer). Anyhow, Empathy aside from being a shutdown skill has a lot of damage potential on mellee targets.

So especially at low levels, I wouldnt recoomend taking Empathy off. I keep it on my PvE skill slots most the time simply because monsters never think to stop attacking through it, and it deals a large chunk of damage to them over time. I use it in the arena as well, and love to wait for a Warrior to come to me only to cast Empathy on him. If I get a lil damage on me just throw up Distortion and pull off an Ether Feast.

Anyhow back to the main problem. I think your solution lies mainly in balancing out your attribute levels. you have a lot in Domination. It wouldnt hurt to knock it down one or two levels and raise the others. And dont try to interrupt the short casting skills. Thats exactly where diversion comes in, as someone mentioned. Diversion their Orison, then cast Backfire. Wait for the next heal skill and hopefully its one you can interrupt. If they dont cast anything, just try to keep them continually shut down and call them as a target. Have your teamates attack them and force them to cast through your Backfire even.

If you can get a decent level of Illusion Magic, Diversion might be worth carrying into the Arenas.

Try staying behind the lines of battle in the begining, so you dont get targeted, and then casting a quick Empathy on some opposing Warrior who is hitting one of your Team mates. Then go for one of the casters with your Backfire, Diversion combo. Energy Burn I usually keep for a finisher. I've finished off a lot of Warriors and Casters alike with Burn. If the healers are the only ones giving you any real trouble, you might look to sub in Energy Tap and use it and Burn as frequently as you can on them, while also trying to maintain a Backfire on them.

Nobleman Azure
02-06-2005, 06:51
the problem with empathy is that you're straying off your role a bit. Id love to bring empathy if i wasnt limited to 8 skill slots. But i do always bring it in PVE, it works wonders.

Most of the times, when you go for domination line you are anti-caster because most of it all is anti casting abilities.

If you're able to employ Domination along with illusion, Empathy isnt a bad idea. (I actually had a long arguement with someone in this boards once about empathy, i think its because he completely brushed off the skill as if it had absolutely no use)



**would be nice though if its actually EMPATHY as in they feel what you feel. If you get hurt this much, they do too rofl.

Saikyo
03-06-2005, 09:59
If you can get a decent level of Illusion Magic, Diversion might be worth carrying into the Arenas.


Actually I believe that diversion is a domination magic skill. Problem is that it only works for 6 seconds and you can't increase the duration of the hex. (Mantra of persistance only works for illusion hexes.) Though in the end, even if they don't cast you still just shut them down for 6 seconds. Of course if you want to be mean, then just throw on a few wastrel's while they are waiting.

And shatter hex is a good spell. Very nice to cast on the healers since it does upwards of 100+ damage on all the warriors who are ganging up on him. The only problem is the large energy cost. Smite hex is decent if you are a monk as it costs less but does less damage. (Maxes around 60 or so I think.)

Tsume
04-06-2005, 06:45
Yah its Domination Magic, I'm not sure if I was thinking of another skill and then got side tracked by Diversion or what there. Just a stinky ole brain fart :P.

But as far as Diversion being useless, well in PvE Monsters cast through it and in PvP your enemies usually dont have a choice. It might not be as effective in Arena as it is elswhere but usually theres so much stuff flying around you get the Diversions off. But its not allways about that, its just the shutdown from them. Any time they are forced to cast through is a bonus.

Nobleman Azure
04-06-2005, 07:45
But as far as Diversion being useless, well in PvE Monsters cast through it and in PvP your enemies usually dont have a choice.

i remember when a PUG monk in tombs let out a wretched cry in TS because the opposing team's mesmer loaded diversions on him XD