Mr. Camper

[Ice Blessings]

In a thread about someone complaining about Ritualists were nothing but campers, I'm here to actually make a dicussion about it. Do you believe Ri's are campers? If so, why?

I believe they are for one reason only. Spirits. I noticed that when you play a Ritualist, it says you can heal "50 x points, blah blah blah" but if you read the descriptions more carefully, they get more powerful when spirits are around. "If you are near a spirit you heal for 100 x points". So therefor, a Ritualist needs to be near his spirits, thus, making him a camper to what it seems like to the other team.

What do you think? Are ritualists campers?

~Ice~

[Patccmoi]

In a thread about someone complaining about Ritualists were nothing but campers, I'm here to actually make a dicussion about it. Do you believe Ri's are campers? If so, why?

I believe they are for one reason only. Spirits. I noticed that when you play a Ritualist, it says you can heal "50 x points, blah blah blah" but if you read the descriptions more carefully, they get more powerful when spirits are around. "If you are near a spirit you heal for 100 x points". So therefor, a Ritualist needs to be near his spirits, thus, making him a camper to what it seems like to the other team.

What do you think? Are ritualists campers?

~Ice~

And why do you have to make 1 big pack of spirits and sit in there? Why can't you spread your spirits a little so you have a big area where you are always near a spirit? We played with 2 Ri and we had spirits all over the place. We were hardly camping at all.

It's new players that don't really seem to grasp how to play a ritualist that put up all spirits in a pack and stay there. You have to bring your spirit in the face of the other team and put them there so they're forced in it. Not sit in your corner surrounded by your ghostly little friends.

Use slowing spell or cripple (can be from allies) to make sure the other team can't just run away, and rush in and spirit all over the place.

Ritualists have GREAT protection (Warding is insane) and very high health (over 600 base health is crazy). You won't die in half a second by rushing in and putting up your stuff.

Players will just have to adapt to the play style, and don't worry in places like GvG, 'camping' is absolutely impossible because it's totally anti-strategic, except when you're talking about sitting by GL. And noticed what ANet did? Now, something like 5 min after VoD the Guild Lord comes out. I'd bet everything that this is to prevent Ritualists to making an army of spirits around the Guild Lord and force the other team in it.

[Acel]

The "offensive-type" ritualists are simply turret builders. Period. Why?

Look at this:-

Pain - Spirit that deals damage.
Bloodsong - Spirit that steals health.
Disenchantment - Spirit that deals damage and strips enchantment.
Dissonance - Spirit that deals damage and interrupts.
Wanderlust - Elite Binding Spirit. Knocksdown.

Once I get these 5 spirits up and the first A/W that runs into range I wand him and then do this:
Doom - Spell that does xx damage for EACH recharging binding ritual(currently 5).

Oh Sweet fractions! :rolleyes: I cant remember how many times i kill them in seconds.

Ps: see, I told you most A/W are idiots! They think shadow step will warp them back in time when they rush out like a headless chicken!

- Wanyan Wulei <-(temp. access keys, no slots on main acct)

[Kjentei]

I think it depends on how far apart a Ritualist spreads his spirits. 'Close together' and 'Far apart' have their advantages and disadvantages. (e.g. 'Close together' is good for lots of healing, but can fall victim to AoE damage) (e.g2. 'Far apart' means the Ritualist's spirits are more effective over a larger area, but it takes longer to set up and might mean the Ritualist has to seperate from his/her group)

[Nobleman Azure]

if they are campers or not i actually prefer them to be powerful campers. That way AOE fire spells would have use again in PVP besides King of the Hill

[Tempest Rave]

obviously they arent just a one line class like the rest, but i think they have been purposefully made so that they would act like turrets. instead of trying to destroy ballista you have to try and kill those ritualists! great move on anets front.

[TBMarauder]

I think you are basing your 'Mr. Camper' assumption too much on what you have experienced this weekend and the fact that just about every 'wannabe' Rt out there is on a 'cookie-cutter' template, consiting of Binding Rituals.

Imagine if Ranger was the new profession they introduced and the only available templates this weekend were of 'spirit'-based builds? See my point? :)

[um104]

i think that everyone is basing their assumptions on the attacking spirits of a Rt. i have yet to see a single thread on the healing parts of a Rit (which i would VERY much like to see). Campers: maybe they put down their spirits, and use the spirits as their main power. Can they move? definetaly. have a group of 2 Rits and 2 anything in Team Arena's, and put spirits all over the place (healing or no), and you've got yourself an excellent territory-marker.
Rits are great for marking territory, from what I've seen. Has anyone tried using a Rit in GvG? Because from what I understand, you could put up a whole mess of spirits around the flagstand, and keep it up all the time.
--um104
PS: if anyone has any good info on the restoration Rit, please thread it up. i would love to hear it!

[Tempest Rave]

I think you are basing your 'Mr. Camper' assumption too much on what you have experienced this weekend and the fact that just about every 'wannabe' Rt out there is on a 'cookie-cutter' template, consiting of Binding Rituals.

Imagine if Ranger was the new profession they introduced and the only available templates this weekend were of 'spirit'-based builds? See my point? :)

Yea, I see your point. I also see the ritualist skill set on this very website (which rules btw) obviously he can do more then camp (like i said) but he seems very suited for causing tactical placing havoc in a way that no other class could dream of.

Classes have to be played with certain points in mind, mes dont generally charge in to melee attack warriors (unless IW, but even then thats risky). I see alot of ritualist skills that would work better if he was staying in an area; the mad rush to kill him before he drops one of his ash holding skills :laugh: in any case ill be trying out all sorts with the class when GW:F comes.

[Eothain Tirion]

I have had games where me and some other rts were blatent campers and had some where we run around, ive had success with both of the styles. It isnt that important to be around spirits but it sure dose help :grin:

[Acel]

Well even one of the spirits - Restoration, suggests "camping" since this spirit rezzes EVERYONE in the area with 50%(15communing) hp when it dies after 30 secs automatically or after it gets killed. People would just want to stay close and still on a spot... if that doesnt suggest camping what does?

[Vexed Arcanist]

Well even one of the spirits - Restoration, suggests "camping" since this spirit rezzes EVERYONE in the area with 50%(15communing) hp when it dies after 30 secs automatically or after it gets killed. People would just want to stay close and still on a spot... if that doesnt suggest camping what does?

I finally had Restoration work after using it many times and it failing. I can however tell you killing the spirit has no effect, I tried to combo it with the Rit skill that blinds/does lightning damage (forget the name) and no one was ressed. I suspect it is bugged or not intended to work unless it times out normally (dies).

I do see the possibility of a strong Rit/R and R/Rit 8v8 team using Nature's Renewal, the blinding/damage skill vs IWAY, etc. However Resolve Nuker's will be the counter of the day.

[Diast]

Chain Spirits

Attribute: Communing

Casting Speed: 3/4 Sec

Cost: 10 E

Recharge: 20 Sec

Attributes (1..12)

For (15...52) seconds, all Spirits in the area you have summoned become Chained to you. While Chained, Spirits will follow you at (15%...45%) movement speed. If you move beyond 10' from any Spirit, this spell ends for that Spirit.

On one hand, this will make Rt's much less prone to camping. On the other however, this could make Spirits too mobile, and throw off a balance.

Comments? Ideas?

[Acel]

I finally had Restoration work after using it many times and it failing. I can however tell you killing the spirit has no effect, I tried to combo it with the Rit skill that blinds/does lightning damage (forget the name) and no one was ressed. I suspect it is bugged or not intended to work unless it times out normally (dies).

I do see the possibility of a strong Rit/R and R/Rit 8v8 team using Nature's Renewal, the blinding/damage skill vs IWAY, etc. However Resolve Nuker's will be the counter of the day.

No, the spirit has to die by itself in 30 secs OR get killed by enemies to work :laugh:(erm dont ask me why) I often cast it and stay on the spot for a bit to bait someone to try hit me... then I run away...they would often switch target and help me kill the spirit. For the enemies they could only watch or kill the spirit...in either case the results is the same(or kill everybody else before the 30 secs is up). Only counter I can see to this is a bunch of chain lightning spikers waiting at the sides for the "auto rezz" and time their cast upon signal..

[Deadly Hawkeye]

Chain Spirits

Attribute: Communing

Casting Speed: 3/4 Sec

Cost: 10 E

Recharge: 20 Sec

Attributes (1..12)

For (15...52) seconds, all Spirits in the area you have summoned become Chained to you. While Chained, Spirits will follow you at (15%...45%) movement speed. If you move beyond 10' from any Spirit, this spell ends for that Spirit.

On one hand, this will make Rt's much less prone to camping. On the other however, this could make Spirits too mobile, and throw off a balance.

Comments? Ideas?
I actually like to have spirits following me. I find having spirits that only stands there a bit boring. However I do realise the issue of overpower!

[TBMarauder]

You would also have to allow Ranger rituals to behave in the same way, in order to maintain balance, would you not?

[Death Dragon]

The "offensive-type" ritualists are simply turret builders. Period. Why?

Look at this:-

Pain - Spirit that deals damage.
Bloodsong - Spirit that steals health.
Disenchantment - Spirit that deals damage and strips enchantment.
Dissonance - Spirit that deals damage and interrupts.
Wanderlust - Elite Binding Spirit. Knocksdown.

Once I get these 5 spirits up and the first A/W that runs into range I wand him and then do this:
Doom - Spell that does xx damage for EACH recharging binding ritual(currently 5).

Oh Sweet fractions! :rolleyes: I cant remember how many times i kill them in seconds.

Ps: see, I told you most A/W are idiots! They think shadow step will warp them back in time when they rush out like a headless chicken!

- Wanyan Wulei <-(temp. access keys, no slots on main acct)

You forgot ShadowSong, which does the same damage as Pain and BloodSong, just is not shown.

[Doyle]

Chain Spirits

Attribute: Communing

Casting Speed: 3/4 Sec

Cost: 10 E

Recharge: 20 Sec

Attributes (1..12)

For (15...52) seconds, all Spirits in the area you have summoned become Chained to you. While Chained, Spirits will follow you at (15%...45%) movement speed. If you move beyond 10' from any Spirit, this spell ends for that Spirit.

On one hand, this will make Rt's much less prone to camping. On the other however, this could make Spirits too mobile, and throw off a balance.

Comments? Ideas?

A minor point, but to me, "Chain Spirits" sounds like you're making them immobile. In fact, the Ritualist Spirits are chained to the ground, aren't they? I think "Bind Spirits" or "Spiritual Affinity" would be a better name.

[JeanDeathwish]

Wow 10'! Thats not that much considering a necro well is 39'. For this to work properly most of your spirits need to be ontop of eachother and you cant move more than a few steps at a time. Someone using this spell will be just asking an ele to come kill them and all their spirits. That said moving your spirits would be a very powerful ability and this spell comes with that huge drawback of distance. So I would say its balanced, but I just wouldnt use it.

[aeonbahamutzero]

well the fact that the Rt is a camper will definately change the way HoH and GvG is going to be played :) can't wait till factions comes out :D

[stueyman]

people keep coming back and saying that the Rt is a camper. this is not true, the Rt CAN be a camper, but they don't have to be. like TB said, most of what we saw were templates. over time, people will find other uses for the Rt than just laying 4 spirits and camping. as mentioned, AoE will put a quick end to that, and Rt's will have to find other tactics to use. I'm really curious to see how the meta game changes when this new class is put in place permanently.

[WingspanTT]

Heh, well, a Ranger can camp too.. I dont' see the big deal.

All the more opportunity for people to use AoE skills again. Expect to see smiting monks and all non lightning ele's all over the place...

I can finally break out my Arcane Echo'ed Maelstrom FTW

[Da Si]

I kinda like the idea. It could be the start of a new Factory build HoH and might compete with Minions, but hey. The distance might have to be altered a bit, because 10' is less than "adjacent" (15' I think). Maybe Well-sized (39'), and also reduces YOUR speed sorta like a Doylak Signet. You could also just make them have 15% speed always and just increase the duration. This would keep it from becoming an [Elite]... Or they could have two versions, much like Dodge and [Escape]. Just an idea. Since the Ritualist is sorta also helpful to Necro Minions, perhaps it should increase their speed by a little. Almost like a mini ["Charge!"].