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Sounds Risky
13-03-2006, 19:55
While waiting for the match to start at the Ascalon Academy in Pre-Searing Ascalon I noticed some stairs and decided to try and walk up them. To my surprise I could and found a large open area you could run around in and even found some banners, though they have been seen before.

http://img455.imageshack.us/img455/9712/banners6un.th.jpg (http://img455.imageshack.us/my.php?image=banners6un.jpg)

The odd bit is that I thought the White Mantle wasn't truly known until after the Searing when they came to the defense of Kryta against the Charr. While they may have been around I wouldn't have thought that the knowledge of them would have spread to Ascalon before the Searing occured. So my thought is that what has been considered solely the symbol of the White Mantle could actually be the symbol of Kryta itself. Thoughts?

Quintus Antonius
13-03-2006, 21:51
The thing is, the White Mantle symbol is most likely a representation of the Mursaat.

Historical texts do speak of Saul D'Alessio travelling around collecting followers for the White Mantle, before it was ever known as the White Mantle. It may be possible that this was a sort of pre-White Mantle embassy or recruitment tent. It's a shame we don't have access to the tent itself, maybe Saul D'Alessio himself was there.

Both the Ascalonians and the Krytans knew of the Charr threat, perhaps the White Mantle had sent envoys to Ascalon to assess the threat of the Charr, Saul might have known, from the Mursaat, that the Charr were massing forces, and sent a force to Ascalon.

The other banners we see are the symbol of the royal house of Ascalon, which includes the King and Rurik. If Rurik was always as reasonable as he appears to be post-Searing, perhaps he decided a meeting with the new faction in Kryta was a good idea, to get on good terms with them.

We also know that around the time of the Searing, and afterwords, Kryta, now under control of the White Mantle, had sent peace missions to Ascalon to try to patch up post-Guild War international ties. Still, I don't believe that happened until Ambassador Zain came after the Searing.

However, a connection must exist. For instance, I mentioned above that Rurik might have been meeting with representatives from the White Mantle because they were becoming powerful. We know the Guild Wars were still happening, or had just ended, at this time, and essentially, the White Mantle was a new, and very powerful guild. The powers to be in Ascalon may have decided to jump at an alliance with a new, Krytan power-seeking guild, so that they could gain an edge in the Guild Wars. Think about it, the White Mantle became very powerful, very fast. Even with the Mursaat's help, they would still need armor, weapons, and other materials to support themselves. Ascalon may have had relations with the White Mantle, and had been supplying them with weapons and the like so they could destablize the, then hostile, Krytan government. Then, after the Searing, in recognition of Ascalon's help in establishing their power, the White Mantle sought to help them.

The only problem is, Adlebern would not have let a Krytan force into Ascalon City, as we see post-Searing with the refusal of allowing Ambassador Zain into Ascalon City. Still, Rurik knew that Kryta was safe after the Searing, and even indirectly aided Zain, which seems to hint he knew the White Mantle could be trusted. Also, Stephen (the henchman) is a Krytan who came before the Searing, fell in love with the country, and stayed to help fight the Charr after the Searing. Early lore on the henchmen that I once read contained that tidbit of information, though I don't remember where I read it.

In my opinion, I would say that tent represents an early White Mantle strength and alliance building mission in Ascalon.

An interesting find indeed!

Eratimus
14-03-2006, 18:18
The blue flag is the royal crest of Ascalon. It is the same emblem on Rurik's and Aldebran's cape, the gate to Ascalon Academy, on the Ascalon tomes and tome pedistals.

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/4705/ascalonemblems0mq.th.jpg (http://img217.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ascalonemblems0mq.jpg)

The tent may also be a Tyrian form of Embassy for Kryta.

Vunduin
17-03-2006, 15:24
I dont have any direct images but also took a few screenies of this area. The Mantle tent is overlooking a pit which to me looks as though it could of staged tournaments?
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b76/DurdainIndarys/MantleSection.jpg
On this picture underneath said royal Ascalon banners a weapon rack can be seen.
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b76/DurdainIndarys/Ascalontourn.jpg
Perhaps the two held some sort of event here? The White Mantle tent being the equivalent of a Royal box? Even if Adelbern disliked Kryta and the Mantle he probably wouldnt snuff the chance to embarrass their champion in a good old fight to the death.

EDIT: Fixed link

terakhan
17-03-2006, 15:40
How did you guys get those screenshots? I didnt think you could actually get into that part of the map.

Vunduin
17-03-2006, 17:14
When you exit Pre searing and the countdown begins for the 4v4 PvP session you can have a wander. I think it varies but i usually have about 2 minutes or so before the match starts.

zweistein
19-03-2006, 20:34
You can also seem them in begining of searing mission:

http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/9664/gw3865jb.th.jpg (http://img507.imageshack.us/my.php?image=gw3865jb.jpg)

Dunnoir
20-03-2006, 00:40
I forget the name of the person, but in pre-searing you get a quest from a Krytan living in Ascalon City (the quest where you have to lead the bees over the bridge). As I recall, said Krytan didnt mention their job, so Im just guessing here, but he may have started a small trading post, selling food, clothing and what-not. Now (again, if my memory serves me well) during the N a z i rule of Germany, any Jewish owned shops had signs outside making it clear that the shops were Jewish. Maybe this is a similar thing. Maybe Adlebern isnt happy that a Krytan is living in his kingdom, but because he wants to appear as a good king, rather than a nasty one, he just trys to single him out in hopes that he will pack up and go back to Kryta.

Vunduin
22-03-2006, 15:27
I know who you mean and also cant remember his name - something like "Naman". Its possible that he owned some sort of stall though I cant see it being in the Ascalon Academy if anywhere he would probably of had it in town? Then again the king may of put him there because he is a Krytan and like you say to single him out and make him go home.

I always wondered why there was a Krytan in the middle of Ascalon when the relationship between the nations was supposedly so bad. The quest involves him searching for a home though doesn't it? If he does not have a house he probably wouldnt have a buisness.

Ranger Nietzsche
22-03-2006, 19:14
That tent is identical to the tent covering the merchant area in LA..suggesting its a merchant tent in Ascalon too perhaps:

http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/3792/mantletent9vs.th.png (http://img53.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mantletent9vs.png)

Quintus Antonius
22-03-2006, 21:01
That tent is identical to the tent covering the merchant area in LA..suggesting its a merchant tent in Ascalon too perhaps:

http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/3792/mantletent9vs.th.png (http://img53.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mantletent9vs.png)

Seems logical to me. The difference between the two is the fact that there is nothing, at least to my knowledge, under the Ascalonian tent.

Konig Des Todes
03-02-2010, 10:51
I find it as odd as the White Mantle flags in the Ascalonian Arena in Pre-searing. :p

Larqh
03-02-2010, 12:03
Now, that's something I never noticed before. That's even MORE odd!

Tim Paradox
01-04-2010, 23:58
I find it as odd as the White Mantle flags in the Ascalonian Arena in Pre-searing. :p

Dunno if anyone has adressed this issue already, but here we go: Before the searing, there was diplomatic contact or whatever you want to call it between Ascalon and Kryta. Kryta at the time was ruled by the white mantle. There's your answer. Maybe it's the Krytan embassy or whatever.

Nohjo
02-04-2010, 00:16
weren't Kryta and Ascalon in a fight back in pre-searing?

Gmr Leon
02-04-2010, 00:44
Not an entirely consistent move, but seeing the interest raised and the topic, I decided to shift the posts to this old thread on the matter.

As to your answer Tim, that isn't entirely accurate. The date at the period of Pre-Searing is quite unclear, so we cannot say with certainty that the White Mantle were the ruling class just yet. This is only compounded by the fact that we have Ascalonian guards mentioning Ascalon's Chosen fighting an Orrian guild, suggesting that when we're playing is only just shortly after the beginning of the Charr invasion, since the Guild Wars were ended by the invasion.

And Nohjo, at one point they were, but it would seem by the time of Pre-Searing the Charr invasion has, at least, halted hostility between Kryta and Ascalon, since they're the two targets under attack at the time.

Konig Des Todes
02-04-2010, 14:14
Dunno if anyone has adressed this issue already, but here we go: Before the searing, there was diplomatic contact or whatever you want to call it between Ascalon and Kryta. Kryta at the time was ruled by the white mantle. There's your answer. Maybe it's the Krytan embassy or whatever.I only have one thing to bring up to shut this down.

Ambassador Zain (http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Ambassador_Zain) was the first ambassador to Ascalon by the White Mantle. And he just showed up.

Tim Paradox
02-04-2010, 19:42
Fine. In that case *I* have one thing to bring up yo shut the entire lore forum down. It's a game, and the devs weren't trying to make a world that is historically accurate. They needed a banner so they took what they had available.

Gmr Leon
02-04-2010, 19:50
:duh: Perhaps I should clarify, as I was reviewing that information, it did appear a bit clearer that all of that could have been occurring without it screwing up the timeline. The White Mantle could have existed back then, but it remains that the royalty may have still been in power at the time. We do see Krytans in Ascalon during Pre-Searing, after all, so while Zain may have been the first ambassador to Ascalon sent by the White Mantle, this could easily be the White Mantle's actions as governing body of Kryta whereas previous presence would have been an upstart religious group and nothing more.

Konig Des Todes
03-04-2010, 09:49
Fine. In that case *I* have one thing to bring up yo shut the entire lore forum down. It's a game, and the devs weren't trying to make a world that is historically accurate. They needed a banner so they took what they had available.Everything, except for the removed or beta lore are non-contradicting once you take a look at this.

This is possibly the only thing which is contradicting. It is a game, but we here are nerds and thus look into the lore of the game. While in the get go there might have been little interest in making lore important, even before the game's release the devs have been interested in the lore.