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Longasc
25-03-2006, 13:53
I had a lot of fun with Death Charge and stuff in the Jade Quarry backstabbing Necros, but in PvE...

I am looking for advice.

Without skills I have the feeling of doing next to no damage. Well, I do not have an Elemental upgrade and this is why I suck against melee mobs even more.
But in general I feel I am done after I did my 1-2-3 combo and added Critical Eye and Flashing Blades. Then I am either doing Shadow Refuge to evade and heal, but I fail in one aspect:

My Spike Damage is not really high, and my constant damage is fast, but low. The DPS does not seem to be that damage dealing either. I can do one spike and then I am out for a while unless I have Moebius and someone shoving me some energy in.

High Critical Strikes and Crit Eye should help with energy, but well, as I said, I have problems.


Any builds/hints and ideas what I can do with my Assassin?

Spoil of War
25-03-2006, 13:57
I think fast but low is what the Assassin is all about IMO. The max damage on daggers is only 17. All I'd suggest is extending that combo. I've managed to come up with a 5 hit that will loop (If I have the energy) and that's doing some real nice damage. Most enemies are generally dead before I can loop (Either that or I am, gotta watch that Shadow Step ;p )

Erasculio
26-03-2006, 04:57
(Either that or I am, gotta watch that Shadow Step ;p )
I have been dying a lot as an Assassin as well :shocked: The Luxon place is easier, but the Kuricz (I have given up on spelling that) is a lot harder.

What I have done, so far, is to either have a long combo (with say, Lead Attack -> Off Hand Attack -> Dual Attack -> Off Hand Attack -> Dual Attack) or to have something shorter, that relies more on conditions than one raw damage. This second approach, taking defensive skills (like the starting Elite Stance) has been somewhat successful.

My real problem are the mobs with the Restoration Spirit and traps, in the area with Lacerate and the other Nature Ritual. The insane degen, with enemies close to each other (so forget teleporting to the healer) and a bunch of traps that knock me dow and cripple me, are more than enough to kill my Assassin in seconds.

With henchies, at least, I have learned to never charge first. This allows the others to take aggro, when I teleport to the back ranks, kill whoever is easy to kill, and run to my own back lines.

Erasculio

Fossa
26-03-2006, 07:02
I always bring 2 lead attack, 1 off-hand and 1 dual.
Lead: Unsuspecting Strike + Disrupting Stab (US main attack, DS for interupts or when US misses)
Off-hand: Fox Fangs (can't miss :wink: )
Dual: Twisting Fangs (because conditions are fun and Deep Wound is a killer)

That usually does a some damage :smiley:

LordShar
26-03-2006, 08:04
Mobius Strike{E} + Twisting Fangs = nice spike dmg :)

I'm also soloing a few mobs at a time using an Asn/War with Heal Sig + Watch Yourself for additional healing and tanking abilities.

Looking forward to Temple-strike...

chennyz
26-03-2006, 08:08
I created an A/R and i found that using daggers with Bestial (Tiger's) Fury can make you attack very fast, since dagger's already attack quite fast

shaktiboi
26-03-2006, 18:49
I've found the key to playing assassin well is to get away from a "pure damage dealer" min-max type of mindset and focus on finding a balance between your weapon skill, Critical Strikes, and Shadow Arts. (I've not found a way to make Deadly Arts useful yet.)

To preface, I always duo with my wife's character, and we use as few henchmen as needed to get the job done in any given zone. In most of the zones we've hit during GW:F preview so far, a 6-person group has been enough, although some of the Kurzick zones require 8 people. Also, my assassin takes point and is usually the first one to wade into the fray, and I'm calling all the targets for the group. There are times I'll send the henchies in first with Ctrl-Shift-Space, but usually I just pop my two buffs, attack first with Ctrl-space, and pop my two damage mitigation spells the minute I start attacking to blunt the effect of the first alpha strike when all the mobs are focused on me.

In general, I'm very survivable in these situations.

What I've found to be the critical factors (pun intended) are these:

1. Maximizing your total crit damage output. For my level 20 A/mo without runes or a critical helm, roughly 24% of my damage output is critical damage with Critical Eye in effect (which it should always be) and with a Dagger Mastery of only 10. (13% base from CS, plus 6% from Critical Eye, plus another effective 5% from double-strikes due to Dagger Mastery).

2. Critical Eye is a key skill, not only because it significantly enhances your crit potential, but because it's your main energy generator. At base 12 Critical Strikes on my preview character so far, I get only 2 energy back per crit, which makes all the difference. As soon as I find a Critical Helm or a minor rune for Critical Strikes, that number jumps 33% to 3 energy back per crit.

3. Damage mitigation skills like Shadow Refuge and Flashing Blades are critical to run whenever you're taking most of the heat, particularly during the first alpha strike of each new encounter.

4. One type of shadow arts skill that teleports you *away* from a cluster of mobs is also invaluable. I like Viper's Defense because it's a relatively long-lasting "buff" I don't have to think about when things get crazy, and it also ups my total damage output. I use this as a get-out-of-jail card when it 's obvious the encounter will go bad. Since I also run Rebirth (the only skill from my Monk Secondary), I can come back after the carnage has died down and safely rez-port my dead comrades to me.

Here's the build I've been liking best, given the paltry selection of skills you get for free on a new character:

-------------
Umeshu Mfume
Critical Helm, Major Vigor on chest, Superor Dagger Mastery on hands, Minor Shadow Arts on feet.

Critical Strikes at the 13th rank gives you base 13% chance to crit (all your damage ignores armor mitigation), but most importantly gives you 3 energy back with each crit.

Shadow Arts should be set high enough to get you 15-20% of your health back with each use of Shadow Refuge, without cutting too much into a high Dagger Mastery.

Dagger Mastery should be high enough to get you a roughly 25% chance of a double strike with each attack. That translates into 25% more critical damage output.

1. Start your two buffs (Viper's Defense and Critical Eye) just before starting a fight, and generally keep both running at all times during battle.

2. Use the three dagger combos whenever there's spare energy for them. But your two damage mitigation skills and your two buffs should always take priority. You can use any lead, off-hand, and dual combos that you like, but I prefer low-cost, fast-recycling combos that don't rely on preconditions.

3. At the start of a larger group fight, when you're most prone to dying from an alpha strike, trigger your two damage mitigation skills (Flashing Blades and Shadow Refuge) immediately when you start attacking. From there on, use as needed when you're taking heavy damage. It's generally best to use Flashing Blades first for instant mitigation, and you can pop off Shadow Refuge twice after that while Flashing Blades is recycling.

4. All you need your Monk secondary for is that very nice rez-with-teleport-to-you skill, Rebirth.

5. If everything goes pear-shaped during a fight and you're facing a total party wipeout, wait for your Viper's Defense to kick in and teleport you out of the thick of things, then run away. With Rebirth you can usually safely rez the entire party even if they died in the middle of a spawn location.



Assassin/Monk
Level: 20

Critical Strikes: 13 (12+1)
Dagger Mastery: 13 (10+3)
Shadow Arts: 9 (8+1)

Viper's Defense (Shadow Arts)
For 30 seconds, the next time you are struck, teleport to a random location nearby. The foe who struck you is poisoned for 14 seconds.
Energy:5 Cast:0 Recharge:10

Critical Eye (Critical Strikes)
For 32 seconds, you have an additional 6% chance to land a critical hit when attacking. You gain 1 Energy whenever you score a critical hit.
Energy:5 Cast:0 Recharge:30

Jagged Strike (Dagger Mastery)
If Jagged Strike hits, your target suffers from Bleeding for 8 seconds.
Energy:5 Cast:0 Recharge:6

Fox Fangs (Dagger Mastery)
Must follow a lead attack. Fox Fangs cannot be "blocked" or "evaded" and strikes for +18 damage if it hits.
Energy:5 Cast:0 Recharge:10

Twisting Fangs (Dagger Mastery)
Must follow an off-hand attack. If it hits, Twisting Fangs strikes for +10 damage and struck foe suffers from Bleeding and Deep Wound for 18 seconds.
Energy:10 Cast:0 Recharge:12

Flashing Blades [Elite] (Dagger Mastery)
For 18 seconds, you have a 50% chance to block incoming attacks while attacking.
Energy:10 Cast:0 Recharge:20

Shadow Refuge (Shadow Arts)
For 4 seconds, you have a 50% chance to "evade" attacks. When Shadow Refuge ends, you are healed for 84.
Energy:5 Cast:1 Recharge:8

Rebirth (Protection Prayers)
Resurrect target party member. Target party member is returned to life with 25% Health and zero Energy, and is teleported to your current location. All of target's skills are disabled for 10..4 seconds. This Spell consumes all of your remaining Energy.
Energy:10 Cast:6 Recharge:0

Xunlai Agent
26-03-2006, 19:02
I think you also need to consider that Assassins are not really team players as much as other classes. I was Assassin/Warrior first (before I heard of the moa) and I used "Watch Yourself" for the team and it is a nice choice in my opinion. I was not using any other Adrenaline skills and I was attacking fast so it was up all the time, so even without a lot of points Tactics the skill was working great.

Pulling off a spike is possible but you really need to acquire the skills to do it that's all. Assassins can do mini spikes on their own and their teleportation skills allow them to pop up right next to the Monks and this is a very good combination. I was constantly spiking monks in PvP and PvE and it definately is possible. Leave the Warriors till last because you are the melee caster killer and taking Warriors can be a bit tough especially the buffed PvE monsters.

shaktiboi
26-03-2006, 21:43
I tweaked my Assassin skills just a bit by swapping out the off-hand and dual dagger attacks for Death's Charge and Shadow of Haste.

Death's Charge (Shadow Arts)
Shadow Step to target foe. If that foe has more Health than you, you are healed for 94.
Energy:5 Cast:1 Recharge:45

Shadow of Haste (Shadow Arts)
For 14 seconds you move 25% faster than normal. When Shadow Step ends, you return to the location where you activated Shadow Step.
Energy:10 Cast:0 Recharge:30


The only dagger special I use any more is Jagged Strike, to keep 3 ticks of bleeding on my target at all times. When Viper's defense kicks in too, that's 7 total ticks of heath degen for a good long time, in addition to my fast, constant dagger damage and lots of criticals.

I find that Death's Charge is another good self-heal and in conjunction with Shadow Refuge, I never fall below half health even when the group's healer goes down. Plus it gives me a good way to get over to any healer or degen mobs *fast* to take them down quickly.

Shadow of Haste is just a nice utility skill for running a big pack away from the group so that the group can pass safely. Probably good for solo farming too to get past trash mobs you don't want to bother fighting.

I find that with the health-topping powers of Death's Charge and Shadow Refuge, I almost never use Flashing Blades any more. At some point I'll probably replace that with another utility skill like Disrupting Stab for interrupting casters.

With this latest tweak I can play the main go-in-first tank for a group with seven henchmen, even in the tough Kurzick areas with lots of level 24 packs with two healers and a mesmer type in the pack. I didn't die once in roughly 20 large encounters, and only had one henchman die in two of those encounters (the healer). I never fell below half health even at the worst of it. Best of all, I can play this with only one hand on the keyboard for better mouse-based targeting (like those pesky healers who arrive from afar to suddenly make things more interesting).

Longasc
27-03-2006, 03:15
This is what works very well usually - PvE only.

1. Leaping Mantis Attack
2. Wild Strike
3. Critical Strike OR Dead Blossom (remember, the dual attack hits twice - Critical Strike gives energy and some extra damage due to the 2x critical hits. Dead Blossom deals damage to adjacent enemies, too, but has higher recharge time)

The idea is to have a low recharge time combo that requires no extras to be effective.
Dead Blossom deals massive damage, but then you require Moebius Strike to charge it up again.

4. Moebius (E) or Flashing Blades (E) - Moebius adds extra damage to the chain, Flashing Blades greatly increases your survivability

5. Critical Eye - a must for every assassin imo
6. Death Charge - not so much to get into trouble, but as a quick heal
7. Shadow Refuge - damage mitigation and heal
8. Rez - Flesh of my Flesh is particulary effective, but an Assassin should attack and not rez in the back actually.

Dagger Mastery: As high as possible, Critical strikes should be high, too. Shadow Refuge works very well with 8-10 Shadow Arts.

Nanashi
27-03-2006, 10:32
I had a lot of fun with Death Charge and stuff in the Jade Quarry backstabbing Necros, but in PvE...

I am looking for advice.

Without skills I have the feeling of doing next to no damage. Well, I do not have an Elemental upgrade and this is why I suck against melee mobs even more.
But in general I feel I am done after I did my 1-2-3 combo and added Critical Eye and Flashing Blades. Then I am either doing Shadow Refuge to evade and heal, but I fail in one aspect:

My Spike Damage is not really high, and my constant damage is fast, but low. The DPS does not seem to be that damage dealing either. I can do one spike and then I am out for a while unless I have Moebius and someone shoving me some energy in.

High Critical Strikes and Crit Eye should help with energy, but well, as I said, I have problems.


Any builds/hints and ideas what I can do with my Assassin?

Well I had no real problems unless I tried to solo in PVE. I mean, I play a ranger most of the time and soloing level 24s+ doesn't happen. So usually I took henchies with me to kick some arse. The build you start out with during the PE is definetly not something you want to take around through the rest of the game; atleast IMO. While Flashing Blades is nice, it's defense still rather low and shouldn't be an elite by my standards. That's just my opinion though, but I ran around with: The begining Mantis attack, Jungle Strike, Death Blossom, and mobious strike.

I gave up critical eye, sure it's a nice little buff but most of the time I'm too busy trying to get combos off so I would miss useing it. Instead, I switched CE with Death's Charge, it really spooks the hell out of mesmers and eles if they aren't watching.

funky wookiepants
27-03-2006, 12:51
What I found worked best for me was to play the assassin in the same way you would a sniper in an FPS. The snipers job is not to go around, guns blazing, killing everything that isn't him; instead, the sniper eliminates a specific target or series of targets, usually high-profile or high-value. Same thing, for me, with the assassin. I don't have enough armour or health to tank it, so I shadow-step to the monk/caster, pull of my loop-able (if need be) and pop back out before I take too much damage. In a way, it's a lot like being a ranger as well.
For the record, scared the hell out of me the first time a Dredge Gutter popped out of nowhere and started attacking us.

Desthe
27-03-2006, 14:48
What I found worked best for me was to play the assassin in the same way you would a sniper in an FPS. The snipers job is not to go around, guns blazing, killing everything that isn't him; instead, the sniper eliminates a specific target or series of targets, usually high-profile or high-value. Same thing, for me, with the assassin. I don't have enough armour or health to tank it, so I shadow-step to the monk/caster, pull of my loop-able (if need be) and pop back out before I take too much damage. In a way, it's a lot like being a ranger as well.
For the record, scared the hell out of me the first time a Dredge Gutter popped out of nowhere and started attacking us.

That's the feeling I'm getting from the class. It's easy to expect "Oh, another Warrior-type with different skills" at first, I know I did when I first created an Assassin, and played it as such for a bit. I'm sure that's how a lot of people went into it as well... but you start to realize that charging in and unloading on the first thing that moves isn't what the Assassin is about.

The best way I can explain how I plan to play an Assassin is that you're a part of the overall party, but at the same time you're not. Assassins should do their own thing, sniping as best they can or softening up high priority targets for the rest of the group.

I was cold to the class at first, but near the end it started to grow on me and now I can't wait to make one when this is released. Funny how that works out sometimes... :P

shadow the hero
27-03-2006, 15:34
Wannebee-Sephiroth build
A/ u choose
dagger mastery: 12 + mask + minor
shadow arts: 10 + minor
critical strikes: 8 + major

skills

Combi: lead attack: jagged strike "bleeding" --> temple strike "dazed and blind" (Elite)--> horns of the ox "knock-down" --> falling spider "poison" --> Etc

Healing skills: death's change "108 hp","shadow step to the foe" and Heart of shadows "68","shadow step away"
Escape skill: Viper's defends "poison" and "shadow step away"

rez signet or restore life

this build works very well in PvE and PvP

Death Condor
27-03-2006, 15:39
I got a drop of a set of Zealous Max dmg daggers. Seemed to help a lot with gettting back some of the energy :)

cheers
Death Condor

Straccan
27-03-2006, 20:31
Zealous is definitely way to go for an assassin (if you want to deal physical damage).

You were really lucky!!

Erasculio
27-03-2006, 20:55
I don't have enough armour or health to tank it, so I shadow-step to the monk/caster, pull of my loop-able (if need be) and pop back out before I take too much damage.
I tried to do that, but I was having trouble finding a way to move away from the enemies. I could teleport to them with Death Charge, for example, but how did you move away after unleashing your combo? I just ran a few times, but that didn't work against some critters.

Erasculio

Desthe
27-03-2006, 20:58
I tried to do that, but I was having trouble finding a way to move away from the enemies. I could teleport to them with Death Charge, for example, but how did you move away after unleashing your combo? I just ran a few times, but that didn't work against some critters.

Erasculio

There is a skill that acts as a maintained enchantment once you cast it. You teleport to an enemy, and once you cancel the enchantment, you teleport back to your original location.

It was featured on the E/A premade during the weekend. I can't remember the name of it though, perhaps someone else would know about it. It seems that could be just the skill you'd be looking for.

Longasc
27-03-2006, 21:38
There is also Spirit Walk, if you have a Ritualist, you can retreat to the spirits. I do not know if it works with ranger spirits.

funky wookiepants
28-03-2006, 05:12
There is a skill that acts as a maintained enchantment once you cast it. You teleport to an enemy, and once you cancel the enchantment, you teleport back to your original location.

It was featured on the E/A premade during the weekend. I can't remember the name of it though, perhaps someone else would know about it. It seems that could be just the skill you'd be looking for.

I think you're thinking of Recall.
Some guildies and I are thinking that runners are gonna LOVE that skill.

GammaRay
28-03-2006, 05:20
I think you're thinking of Recall.
Some guildies and I are thinking that runners are gonna LOVE that skill.

I can't remember for the life of me what the skill's name was, but it exists. It's an elite that teleports you to target foe. It's a maintained enchantment, and when it ends, you teleport back to your original location. Used it extensively in the first preview weekend for a quick telegank.

However, if it gets shattered...oops.

Combine it with Shadow Step (which got renamed since then -- it's the dash that teleports you when it's done), and you can utterly confuse people by teleporting to them, smacking them around, turning on the stance, ending the enchantment, and then when Shadow Step ends, you're right on top of them again with no warning.

Nanashi
28-03-2006, 05:32
I can't remember for the life of me what the skill's name was, but it exists. It's an elite that teleports you to target foe. It's a maintained enchantment, and when it ends, you teleport back to your original location. Used it extensively in the first preview weekend for a quick telegank.

However, if it gets shattered...oops.

Combine it with Shadow Step (which got renamed since then -- it's the dash that teleports you when it's done), and you can utterly confuse people by teleporting to them, smacking them around, turning on the stance, ending the enchantment, and then when Shadow Step ends, you're right on top of them again with no warning.

Bah, I forget the name of that skills but yes I remember that one. Although, it's not an elite is it? Recall I believe works on allies and then theres the one you speak of but I can't quite put my finger on it. It could be recall but I'm haveing my doubts. Personally, I never used it. I used deaths charge and vipers defense.

Shadow Step, I believe, was changed do to copyright issues with SoE. Necromancers in Everquest had a skill called shadow step which worked like V'sD does now. It would teleport you to a random location... personally I thought it was useless in that game heh. Yeah, now it's called Shadow Of Haste.

[EDIT: In the assassin Elite list I believe the skill that is an enchantment and teleports you to foe before teleporting you back to the spot in which you activated the skill (upon loseing the enchantment), was identified as Aura Of Displacement and it is an elite.]

shadow the hero
28-03-2006, 14:08
Aura of displacement i think it was?

Longasc
28-03-2006, 15:00
On a sidenote, any char builder out there that takes the changes of the Beta WE in account?

GWFreaks Assassin skill database is outdated, I noticed a lot of differences.

Necromas
28-03-2006, 16:06
Can someone remind me what the skill is that makes all your attacks undodgable for like 12 seconds? It seems this skill would fix the problem of a single miss ruining an assassin combo.

shaktiboi
28-03-2006, 17:43
Can someone remind me what the skill is that makes all your attacks undodgable for like 12 seconds? It seems this skill would fix the problem of a single miss ruining an assassin combo.

Expose Defenses (Deadly Arts)

For x seconds, target opponent cannot block or evade your attacks.

Pie Frenzy
28-03-2006, 23:26
1. lead attack is ummm i forgot its either jagged strike or something else
2. jungle strike (i think)
3. blank blank steel (bought at trainer)
4. moublulous strike (elite)
5.shadow of haste
6.dash (or res sig)
7.deaths charge
8.recall



good pvp build (on pve but doing pvp)

lady lorwinia
28-03-2006, 23:49
I use an R/a for tiger's fury + apply poison + some evades.

Much better than assassin primary. The degen and evades and attaack speed more than makes up for not going max in dagger mastery.

Plus the great energy you get with expertise

Wynter Zera
29-03-2006, 01:37
1. lead attack is ummm i forgot its either jagged strike or something else
2. jungle strike (i think)
3. blank blank steel (bought at trainer)
4. moublulous strike (elite)
5.shadow of haste
6.dash (or res sig)
7.deaths charge
8.recall



good pvp build (on pve but doing pvp)
That's Mobius Strike....

Azgalon
29-03-2006, 02:57
That's Mobius Strike....

That's Moebius Strike.....