shaktiboi

07-04-2006, 21:09

I regularly see the statement given as "fact" that Expertise is obviously better than Critical Strikes in terms of energy-efficiency.

Is it?

I don't fully know the answer to this question, but hopefully we can get to a *real* answer by the time this thread peters out.

First, I'll throw out some factual numbers about the overal energy regen of Critical Strikes, Critical Eye (which is a useful CS skill that many Assassin primaries will take), and even Siphon Strength, which looks to be pretty strong based on the FPE stats (recycled every 10 seconds instead of every 30 seconds during FPE).

Assume the optimum Dagger Mastery / Critical Strikes stats, which is 16 DM and 13 CS (much better than 13 DM and 16 CS, see the Dagger FAQ for why this is so). With these base stats of 16 DM and 13 CS:

Your dagger speed is 1.00 seconds per swing

Your crit chance is 34% and you get back 3 energy per crit.

If you stack Critical Eye on top of that, your crit chance goes up to 40% and you get back 4 energy per crit.

If you further stack Siphon Strength on top of that, your crit chance goes up to 73% (4 energy per crit) for every 7 seconds out of 12 if you have the energy to keep spamming Siphon Strength during combat.

So with these numbers, here is your effective energy regen per second (EPS):

34% crit chance: + 1.02 EPS (3.1 pips) (.34 x 3)

40% crit chance: + 1.60 EPS (4.8 pips)( (.40 x 4)

73% crit chance: + 2.37 EPS (7.2 pips) ([[.73 x [7/12]] + [.40 x [5/12]] x 4])

How do regen numbers like these compare to the energy savings of Expertise?

At 12 ranks in Expertise, we have a 48% reduction in energy cost for most of your skill types:

A 5 energy skill costs only 3.4 energy

A 10 energy skill costs only 6.8 energy

A 15 energy skill costs only 10.1 energy

Let's do a few comparisons now:

Repeating Strike is a great skill to start with because it's instant cast and you can keep spamming it until you miss or run out of energy. Let's assume a lucky run with no misses, so we just spam it once per second till the energy's gone:

34% Crit chance: Expertise > Critical Strikes

Expertise : 3.40 energy cost per Repeating Strike

Critical Strikes: 3.98 energy cost per Repeating Strike (5 - 1.02)

40% Crit chance: Expertise = Critical Strikes + Critical Eye

Expertise : 3.40 energy cost per Repeating Strike

Critical Strikes: 3.40 energy cost per Repeating Strike (5 - 1.60)

73% Crit chance: Expertise < Critical Strikes + Critical Eye + Siphon Strength

Expertise : 3.40 energy cost per Repeating Strike

Critical Strikes: 2.63 energy cost per Repeating Strike (5 - 2.37)

Our Repeating Strike example isn't realistic, though, because eventually Repeating Strikes does miss, which brings up the real factor to consider when comparing Expertise to Critical-based regen. Which is...

Dead time between hotkey attacks. Time when you're waiting for skills to recycle. Time when Expertise is doing nothing for you, but critical-based regen is still working for you because you're still making normal attacks once per second and still getting crits.

So let's look at a more reasonable attack chain from a build with three attack skills in it (a nice, fast dagger combo, of course) and some kind of damage mitigation skill thrown in after the combo, because you've got nothing else to do while waiting the the combo to recycle

Mantis Sting > Jungle Strike > Twisting Fangs > Shadow Refuge

5 energy > 5 energy > 10 energy > 5 energy.... Repeat after 12 seconds.

(This is one of the faster repeating dagger combos, btw. Other combos will take longer to recycle, and will actually provide an even better margin over Expertise than what I'm about to demonstrate.)

To compare the efficiency of Expertise versus critical-based regen in examples where you've got down time between hotkey skills, it's useful to add up the total "extra" energy gained over time. In this case, we're looking at 12 seconds.

34% Crit chance: Expertise < Critical Strikes

Expertise : 6.4 "extra" energy during 12 seconds (1.6 energy > 1.6 energy > 3.2 energy > 1.6 energy)

Critical Strikes: 10.2 "extra" energy during 12 seconds (1.02 EPS x 12)

40% Crit chance: Expertise < Critical Strikes + Critical Eye

Expertise : 6.4 "extra" energy during 12 seconds (1.6 energy > 1.6 energy > 3.2 energy > 1.6 energy)

Critical Strikes: 19.2 "extra" energy during 12 seconds (1.60 EPS x 12)

73% Crit chance: Expertise < Critical Strikes + Critical Eye + Siphon Strength

Expertise : 6.4 "extra" energy during 12 seconds (1.6 energy > 1.6 energy > 3.2 energy > 1.6 energy)

Critical Strikes: 28.44 "extra" energy during 12 seconds (2.37 EPS x 12)

Unless I'm totally missing something very important, I think these two examples pretty clearly show that overall, Critical-based regen from the Critical Strikes attribute (and its related skills) is FAR superior to the efficiency gained from Expertise.

I could be missing something, however. If so, please help us all out by explaining where I'm wrong. Whatever the outcome, it will end up in Version 3 of my Dagger FAQ.

Is it?

I don't fully know the answer to this question, but hopefully we can get to a *real* answer by the time this thread peters out.

First, I'll throw out some factual numbers about the overal energy regen of Critical Strikes, Critical Eye (which is a useful CS skill that many Assassin primaries will take), and even Siphon Strength, which looks to be pretty strong based on the FPE stats (recycled every 10 seconds instead of every 30 seconds during FPE).

Assume the optimum Dagger Mastery / Critical Strikes stats, which is 16 DM and 13 CS (much better than 13 DM and 16 CS, see the Dagger FAQ for why this is so). With these base stats of 16 DM and 13 CS:

Your dagger speed is 1.00 seconds per swing

Your crit chance is 34% and you get back 3 energy per crit.

If you stack Critical Eye on top of that, your crit chance goes up to 40% and you get back 4 energy per crit.

If you further stack Siphon Strength on top of that, your crit chance goes up to 73% (4 energy per crit) for every 7 seconds out of 12 if you have the energy to keep spamming Siphon Strength during combat.

So with these numbers, here is your effective energy regen per second (EPS):

34% crit chance: + 1.02 EPS (3.1 pips) (.34 x 3)

40% crit chance: + 1.60 EPS (4.8 pips)( (.40 x 4)

73% crit chance: + 2.37 EPS (7.2 pips) ([[.73 x [7/12]] + [.40 x [5/12]] x 4])

How do regen numbers like these compare to the energy savings of Expertise?

At 12 ranks in Expertise, we have a 48% reduction in energy cost for most of your skill types:

A 5 energy skill costs only 3.4 energy

A 10 energy skill costs only 6.8 energy

A 15 energy skill costs only 10.1 energy

Let's do a few comparisons now:

Repeating Strike is a great skill to start with because it's instant cast and you can keep spamming it until you miss or run out of energy. Let's assume a lucky run with no misses, so we just spam it once per second till the energy's gone:

34% Crit chance: Expertise > Critical Strikes

Expertise : 3.40 energy cost per Repeating Strike

Critical Strikes: 3.98 energy cost per Repeating Strike (5 - 1.02)

40% Crit chance: Expertise = Critical Strikes + Critical Eye

Expertise : 3.40 energy cost per Repeating Strike

Critical Strikes: 3.40 energy cost per Repeating Strike (5 - 1.60)

73% Crit chance: Expertise < Critical Strikes + Critical Eye + Siphon Strength

Expertise : 3.40 energy cost per Repeating Strike

Critical Strikes: 2.63 energy cost per Repeating Strike (5 - 2.37)

Our Repeating Strike example isn't realistic, though, because eventually Repeating Strikes does miss, which brings up the real factor to consider when comparing Expertise to Critical-based regen. Which is...

Dead time between hotkey attacks. Time when you're waiting for skills to recycle. Time when Expertise is doing nothing for you, but critical-based regen is still working for you because you're still making normal attacks once per second and still getting crits.

So let's look at a more reasonable attack chain from a build with three attack skills in it (a nice, fast dagger combo, of course) and some kind of damage mitigation skill thrown in after the combo, because you've got nothing else to do while waiting the the combo to recycle

Mantis Sting > Jungle Strike > Twisting Fangs > Shadow Refuge

5 energy > 5 energy > 10 energy > 5 energy.... Repeat after 12 seconds.

(This is one of the faster repeating dagger combos, btw. Other combos will take longer to recycle, and will actually provide an even better margin over Expertise than what I'm about to demonstrate.)

To compare the efficiency of Expertise versus critical-based regen in examples where you've got down time between hotkey skills, it's useful to add up the total "extra" energy gained over time. In this case, we're looking at 12 seconds.

34% Crit chance: Expertise < Critical Strikes

Expertise : 6.4 "extra" energy during 12 seconds (1.6 energy > 1.6 energy > 3.2 energy > 1.6 energy)

Critical Strikes: 10.2 "extra" energy during 12 seconds (1.02 EPS x 12)

40% Crit chance: Expertise < Critical Strikes + Critical Eye

Expertise : 6.4 "extra" energy during 12 seconds (1.6 energy > 1.6 energy > 3.2 energy > 1.6 energy)

Critical Strikes: 19.2 "extra" energy during 12 seconds (1.60 EPS x 12)

73% Crit chance: Expertise < Critical Strikes + Critical Eye + Siphon Strength

Expertise : 6.4 "extra" energy during 12 seconds (1.6 energy > 1.6 energy > 3.2 energy > 1.6 energy)

Critical Strikes: 28.44 "extra" energy during 12 seconds (2.37 EPS x 12)

Unless I'm totally missing something very important, I think these two examples pretty clearly show that overall, Critical-based regen from the Critical Strikes attribute (and its related skills) is FAR superior to the efficiency gained from Expertise.

I could be missing something, however. If so, please help us all out by explaining where I'm wrong. Whatever the outcome, it will end up in Version 3 of my Dagger FAQ.