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Ravious Pretagata
01-05-2006, 17:57
This tag attached by Quintus Antonius-Lore Forum Moderator:
The proceeding and subsequent posts may contain Guild Wars: Factions' ***SPOILERS***. Be advised, and read at your own risk.













There is a quest called Luxury Goods where you hand out mirrors created "from far off Elona".

So, this confirms that the "nation" of Elona is still a true place, and the Elonans did not commit mass suicide in the Crystal Desert, a whole swath of them merely wnet there to Ascend and failed.

I would bet many (given good odds) that the next Chapter deals with Elona.

Quintus Antonius
01-05-2006, 20:34
Can you please provide more information, like screenshots of the quest dialouge, or even more on the location you found it? That would be most helpful.

halfthought
01-05-2006, 20:59
actually, the quest is in the bazaar, and thats the only useful peice odf dialogue there... the thing im thinking is bringing them to crystal dessert and see if anything happens, like the totem of slow doing something etc

Quintus Antonius
02-05-2006, 00:50
actually, the quest is in the bazaar, and thats the only useful peice odf dialogue there... the thing im thinking is bringing them to crystal dessert and see if anything happens, like the totem of slow doing something etc

Well considering it is a Canthan quest, and the Crystal Desert is rather far from Cantha, "far off Elona" could very well be the Elonian nation that once stood in the Desert, and the mirrors in question could be antiquity, and thus, more valuble.

Valrena
02-05-2006, 19:01
Hey, first post, hello everyone.

I just finished this quest today, and I'm not sure they would be considered valuable or antiques as the quest requires that you give them to homeless canthans, and if they were old and valuable I doubt they would be given away (though it is possible the Celestrial Ministry, the ones giving them, are ignorant of their worth, as the members I've dealt with so far seem completely out of touch with anything beside themselves). Hope this helps.

Cealin De Rythia
02-05-2006, 19:20
There is other proof that Elona still exists. In the "preface" to the GW: F game guide, Loremaster Ermenred mentions Ascalon says "At the time of this writing, the kingdom of Ascalon is recovering from the conflict with the Charr and is establishing new treaties with the Krytans and the Elonians.

Quintus Antonius
02-05-2006, 20:44
There is other proof that Elona still exists. In the "preface" to the GW: F game guide, Loremaster Ermenred mentions Ascalon says "At the time of this writing, the kingdom of Ascalon is recovering from the conflict with the Charr and is establishing new treaties with the Krytans and the Elonians.

Well then, that is awesome. Looks like Chapter 3 may have the Egyptian theme that everyone says is rumored, and that the Elonians still exist. I'm excited to see where this goes, as Elona was rather advanced in the Desert. It must be an amazing culture.

Stardrake
03-05-2006, 05:09
Hey, first post, hello everyone.

I just finished this quest today, and I'm not sure they would be considered valuable or antiques as the quest requires that you give them to homeless canthans, and if they were old and valuable I doubt they would be given away (though it is possible the Celestrial Ministry, the ones giving them, are ignorant of their worth, as the members I've dealt with so far seem completely out of touch with anything beside themselves). Hope this helps.

Well, it would be the equivalent to people giving out priceless Ming vases to the poor, thinking that's what they need when it's just not (although if they were smart they could try selling them). Although I can see the Ministry doing just that... (Who knows, maybe it's some underhanded evolution program so that those who have the brains to think of selling them can get out of their poverty-stricken state...)

Still, it does sound like it's more likely they are a going concern somewhere. I'd been thinking recently that while the location of Chapter 2 was well introduced, there wasn't much in the way of a third location for Chapter 3. If Elona is still a going concern, however, then Chapter 3 has indeed been better foreshadowed than we thought...

Although it does raise the question of how the Elonians would react to Ascended Prophecies characters...

Omigawa
03-05-2006, 12:26
Ghosts? Ghosts scare me. Do I really want to be surrounded by faint blue glows everywhere I go? It's a dull sight, you should make it so you can see their armor as it would be physical, but they themselves are the spirit. Because as we all know, spirits are physical beings. (err.. righto)

Cyberman
03-05-2006, 13:03
'm not sure they would be considered valuable or antiques as the quest requires that you give them to homeless canthans, and if they were old and valuable I doubt they would be given away
You should try to reread the texts.
The last(I think) homeless Canthan even mentions that "each year the ministry tries to outdo themselves by giving us even more expensive but useless things"(not a transcript - recalled from memory).

I think itīs supposed to be a joke from the devs - the ministries(spelling?) all try to do their best while failing miserably without noticing.
One quest sends you across the place several times, just to find out that the supply isnīt there anymore.

Warison
04-05-2006, 17:08
There is an NPC at Amnoon Oasis in the Desert that states generally that his family was granted the trading rights (or something like that) to the Crystal desert region generations ago. It is difficult to ascertain his background from his limited conversation. However, it leads me to believe that at sometime the Crystal Desert was a Canthan territory or holding. Maybe artifacts from the Elona (in the desert) were transported to Cantha over the years.

Quintus Antonius
04-05-2006, 17:21
But it took over a thousand years to get them to Cantha? The way the Minister speaks suggests that the mirrors are new and freshly arrived from Elona.

Cealin De Rythia
04-05-2006, 19:29
We also must realize that the Tyrian map doesn't show the limits of the desert, or the places near it. There may have been some Elonians who were not wiped out, and simply migrated farther south or east.

Warison
04-05-2006, 21:19
I was merely pointing out the existence of this npc, not necessarily suggesting that the mirrors originated in the desert. He's definately a Canthan link to the desert.

Aaelos Aragrond
04-05-2006, 22:20
Wait! I was reading this and I just remembered.... didn't Gaile hint at a desert setting for chapter 3? Or was I just having a pipe dream :undecided:

Bilateralrope
04-05-2006, 23:23
Well, there are still ghosts in Elona.

They might still be making the mirrors simply because they have nothing else to do. I mean some of them work as merchants

Quintus Antonius
05-05-2006, 01:44
Well, there are still ghosts in Elona.

They might still be making the mirrors simply because they have nothing else to do. I mean some of them work as merchants

I don't think this is a satsifactory answer, as we don't know the nature of the ghosts in the Crystal Desert. Can we see them due to our nature as Chosen, or are they there all the time? Are they always there or did they simply appear because of the coming completion of the Flameseeker Prophecies, or because someone sought Ascension?

Why would Cantha be in international negotiations with a nation of ghosts? Also, did the ghosts of the Desert find rest after we successfully Ascend? (Remember that time in the outposts is essentially static and isn't an accurate measure of real time).

While it is possible, I suppose, that the ghosts require things such as trade and make mirrors (which they probably can't see themselves in, nor have a use for as they can't exactly wear clothing or need to worry about their hairstyles), we must also take into account that the Elonians came from somewhere, and some branch of their race must exist some place on Tyria.

So, the ghosts may have made the mirrors, but until more information is provided either proving or disproving that hypothesis, I'm going to keep looking for more corporeal explanations.

ShadowSword
05-05-2006, 16:19
A nation of Elonans sounds much more likely. Whether or not ANET decide to mimplement that as Chapter 3...

Serena Corvidae
06-05-2006, 08:03
As I understood it Elona Reach, was just an outpost of the Elonian Empire from which they tried to become Ascended, not the Empire itself. I imagine that Elona itself will be a separate continent like Tyria and Cantha.

hendryx
06-05-2006, 11:07
Well in the lore in the Factions Guidebook, it states that some historions believe that there was a Luxon presence in the crystal desert over a thousand years ago. However it does also state that just as many believe this to be a bad conclusion from the evidence.

I can't remember where I saw it, but there is a reference to "Tyria & Elonian people" I believe in some NPC dialog (I'll have to keep my eye out for it now again) which seemed to reference the Elonian's as an active culture and sperate from the other Tyria areas. In fact, in the Factions (and the Guide) it seems that there is a lot of things where they are purposly sparse with information regarding both the Kurzick and the Luxons.

Later on, my conclusion may change with more evedence from E3 and the summer, but I have a strong feeling that the next chapter may in fact focus, at least a bit, on the Elonian's and at least one of the vesal states cultures.

scars of insanity
06-05-2006, 12:33
the mission in the crystall dysert with this name in it "Elona Reach" kinda sounds like a settlement to me. Mabye the Elonians made settlements in the desert then the Forgotten came and killed them all. I bet Elona is to the East.

Quintus Antonius
06-05-2006, 17:41
the mission in the crystall dysert with this name in it "Elona Reach" kinda sounds like a settlement to me. Mabye the Elonians made settlements in the desert then the Forgotten came and killed them all. I bet Elona is to the East.

Well, you are only half right there. Elona Reach does refer to a settlement, which is literally like a reach of the Elonian nation. However, the Forgotten did not kill the Elonians in the Desert, they killed themselves.

There are several on-going topics discussing the various cultures of the Crystal Desert, their origins, spans, and downfalls, which you may find interesting. I'd also prefer that you keep conversations on related topics in those topics, instead of making multiple Desert cultures threads.

http://forums.gwonline.net/showthread.php?t=393765
http://forums.gwonline.net/showthread.php?t=386107

Barinthus
06-05-2006, 17:51
http://img414.imageshack.us/img414/9015/luxurygoods2ot.th.jpg (http://img414.imageshack.us/my.php?image=luxurygoods2ot.jpg)

Quest information

False Visage
06-05-2006, 17:54
I had to agree with the beggars...I mean, Mirrors???

I'm surprised though, I'd expect items like these to get soaked up in the beaurocracy, especially given the amount of corruption and red tape we hear about the Ministries.

Cyberman
06-05-2006, 19:51
I'm surprised though, I'd expect items like these to get soaked up in the beaurocracy, especially given the amount of corruption and red tape we hear about the Ministries.

Well, we DID deliver only three mirrors, right?

Barinthus
07-05-2006, 02:02
Them lucky sods, getting garden gnomes coming to them.

Melly
04-06-2006, 16:19
I forget exactly where now, but I read Cantha is set far south of Tyria. Maybe Elona is in the middle between Cantha and Tyria, as a southern or southeastern extension of the Crystal Desert?

Heath Laron
04-06-2006, 17:28
I don't know, but after hearing basic details from Nightfall, the Elonia theory is seeming to become increasingly likely. It's actually getting me quite excited, the way the chapters have been thought out like this (if it's true). I mean, they went to the Crystal Desert, which would be similar to parts of their homeland (a north African setting). And yeah, I remember doing that quest. I never used to read the Lore Forum, but after seeing "far off Elonia" in that quest, it made my mind link back to Prophecies, and join the dots. Jeeze, we have months to wait, but this Elonia theory is intriguing.

(This Celestial Ministry handing out mirror thing sounds like the devs having a whack at the Governments in some countries - trying to fix something, but trying the wrong means.)

I agree that Elonia could be an expansion of the Crystal Desert, but it would have to be some considerable distance for the Tyrians to not have arrived there yet. It baffles me why Cantha has trade routes with Elonia whilst Tyria does not.

Mularc Templare
05-06-2006, 03:01
Heath Laron, I think I may have an answer to your question.

If Elona is in the loaction which you put it (I'd agree with that asessment somewhat) then it would be across a large desert area - with the Crystal desert as tretchourous (sp?) as it sounds, Tyrian's may have been trying to reach it for years, but never quite getting there.

How is Cantha then more able to get there? Cantha trades via ship - the simply sail, maybe a long way round, but still sail to the central port city for the Elonian nation. Being so far away, they tend to have more access to the rest of Tyria the world the Tyria the Continent.

Mularc

Heath Laron
05-06-2006, 09:46
That's understandable. ^_^ But, why don't the Tyrians trade with them? If there is trade between Tyria and Cantha, then Tyria would be aware with Cantha's relationship to Elona? The trade route between Tyria and Cantha is also by ship, so why wouldn't the Tyrians be able to use a boat route to Elona, even if it was the same one the Canthans took?

Quintus Antonius
05-06-2006, 16:57
Elona may have had isolationist international policies before now, or it simply was unknown.

Just because something exists, doesn't exactly mean they need to trade with anyone. Look at Japan and China up until about the early to mid-19th century.

Also, if Elona is advanced enough to employ floating cities, they may simply have no interest in trading with countries that still war among their factions/guilds or are infested with giant ravionous lion people and plagueborn angry undead led by disgruntled Envoys.

Still, if you want me to be honest, I think that ANet may read our research and is incorporating our findings into their storylines. We may actually be an unnamed writer for Guild Wars. Interesting thought, no?

Heath Laron
05-06-2006, 17:45
Still, if you want me to be honest, I think that ANet may read our research and is incorporating our findings into their storylines. We may actually be an unnamed writer for Guild Wars. Interesting thought, no? Quite a nice thought. ^

The only thing I was getting at was: there is trade between Tyria and Cantha, but also trade between Cantha and Elona. I know it's possible (albeit unlikely,) that Tyria and Cantha traded with each other without word of Elona, but it's too... boring. If China had trade with Japan, and Europe was trading with China, it is more likely than not that Europe would know about Japan also, even if they weren't trading with them. Most characters in Prophecies know nothing about Elona, which supports the final statement you made.

Quintus Antonius
05-06-2006, 17:57
Think about it though. Browse around the forums, how many things that we came up with a year before Factions ended up in Factions? I'm willing to bet we see some things in Nightfall that are inspired by the things we are trying to unravel now. Big Brother is watching, and it isn't your beloved (I can hope, right?) lore moderator either (me).

Anyway, back on topic. There isn't trade between Elona and Cantha yet. From language in-game, it appears that Cantha is attempting to set up diplomatic and economic relationships with Elona. Also, because time is static in Tyria, that is, it stays the same with limited moves forward, Tyria may very well know about Elona, and we just aren't privy to that because time doesn't do anything for us.

Docho
05-06-2006, 19:15
Quite a nice thought. ^

The only thing I was getting at was: there is trade between Tyria and Cantha, but also trade between Cantha and Elona. I know it's possible (albeit unlikely,) that Tyria and Cantha traded with each other without word of Elona, but it's too... boring. If China had trade with Japan, and Europe was trading with China, it is more likely than not that Europe would know about Japan also, even if they weren't trading with them. Most characters in Prophecies know nothing about Elona, which supports the final statement you made.
Wel it isn't so strange that the Tyrian nations don't mention Elona.
The only harbor with significance in Tyria is in Lions Arch, wich is actually a very tiny harbor comared to the the Seitung Harbor and Kaineng Docks. If you think about it that means that Cantha trades with way more Kingdoms/Empires then Kryta alone(and of course the Battle Isles). I dare to say that Cantha is a bit like India in the Middle Ages, the economical centre of the world. The europeans never went to China or Japan, except for a few people like Marco Polo, but only to the big harbors in India. China traded with India and we traded with with India , we knew China and Japan exsisted but we had NO idea how this countries looked like.
So that means that if Tyria knows Cantha and Cantha knows (IF) Elona that doesn't necessarily means that Tyria knows Elona.
It is only since Marco Polo that we learned a bit about their culture. A bit.
I have a history-book at home with a drawing made from someone who had read "Il Milione"(=the book about Marco Polo his travels) and those drawings were inspired on the book and believe me, they don't look like China at all. (I will post a description later when I've found the book). So even if Tyria has heard about Elona via Cantha that could still mean they have no ideo how Elone is like.

Quintus Antonius
05-06-2006, 19:35
Well, it's important to remember that Marco Polo may not have even made it to China. There is speculation he only made it as far as the Black Sea where Mongols occupied at the time, and his drawings and accounts reflect this, instead of China like we are widely led to believe.

But your point is correct there, just because we know of the place Elona doesn't mean that we know the culture of said place.

Haravin Anubis
11-06-2006, 21:38
Sorry ofr reviving this. But I recall that Nightfall has, according to some, an 'African' theme, and a piece of artwork was shown depicting a 'flying mosque'. Could this be Elona? Notice that there are no statue of the gods in the desert - and, in Muslim culture (mosques - also, some African Countries are predominantly composed of Muslims), Idol-Worship is forbidden... this includes sculpture. Just like the Canthans have very few 'independant' statues, and yet all ressurection shrines do, perhaps Elona has a tradition of no statues of the gods at all? Forgive me if I'm wrong.

Quintus Antonius
11-06-2006, 22:03
Haravin, my friend, no forgiveness is needed for error. It is part of learning, and no thread in the Lore Forum is considered "dead", so post whatever you feel necessary.

The problem with what you are proposing is that the Elonians went to the Crystal Desert to Ascend and become closer to the gods. This wouldn't make much sense if they didn't believe in or worship those gods.