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wazzupi
11-06-2006, 09:27
HI was wondering what would be the best warrior stance to use for pvp ??? because i am having a hard time looking for a good one or anything worth using (all around best for defense) plz help ! one more thing non-elite !!

FireballX
11-06-2006, 09:45
PvP? Frenzy or Tiger Stance, depending on how skilled you are at watching your surroundings.

wazzupi
11-06-2006, 09:52
actually i was thinking about something with defense? pvp (alliance battles)

Holb
11-06-2006, 10:11
I would say Battle Rage.

Xunlai Agent
11-06-2006, 10:53
In PvP you are there to deal some damage not tank...
So Frenzy, Zerker's Stance, Tiger's Stance or Battle Rage

Kendra Ardesh
11-06-2006, 13:17
You don't need defensive stances in PVP, nobody hits warriors.

DarkZeal
11-06-2006, 18:56
Primal Rage. Dwarven Battle Stance comes in close second.

Fade Into Shadow
11-06-2006, 19:04
Glad's defense is really nice as well.

Symbolic Self
11-06-2006, 19:39
NO. NOT Glad's defense. Every time a warrior takes Glad's Defense into PvP God kills a kitten.

Think of the kittens.

Buddah
11-06-2006, 19:42
Sprint or Rush for alliance battles are probably the best stances.

IAS really are over rated especially when you get people who turn tale and run after the first hit. I'd rather be able to at least pace, if not outright run them down, then have a quick attack animation occassionally before trying to close the gap once again.

DarkZeal
11-06-2006, 19:43
NO. NOT Glad's defense. Every time a warrior takes Glad's Defense into PvP God kills a kitten.

Think of the kittens.

Lolol

Why would you take Glad's Defence when you got Primal Rage?????? : DDD

Use your brains people!!1

Tigris Of Gaul
11-06-2006, 20:37
Sprint and Rush are awesome skills.

Arctus Redryn
11-06-2006, 21:42
Rush. Almost Adrenaline Rush, eh?

Shiggidyshwa
12-06-2006, 17:44
I'd go with Battle Rage for AB. People kite, you hit and get 2 adrenaline, so you can use your attacks more frequently.

Samurai Jack
12-06-2006, 19:54
Problem is that warriors are just as vunerable as a mage in alliance battles because they can get focused on, especially if that one warrior is alone. When I use my war, I usually bring Shield Stance to buy some time for my allies, either to run away or join the fight.

gwchi
12-06-2006, 20:01
I like balanced stance, but mostly for a/w. ignores shock interupption and you dont get crit by other assassins.

Symbolic Self
12-06-2006, 22:24
Problem is that warriors are just as vunerable as a mage in alliance battles because they can get focused on, especially if that one warrior is alone. When I use my war, I usually bring Shield Stance to buy some time for my allies, either to run away or join the fight.

Any non retarded enemy is going to target someone else once they see shield stance. You've just wasted a slot on your bar by bringing it, and to make matters worse you've become completely useless in a fight since shield stance slows you down.

cranialexodus
12-06-2006, 22:37
battle rage or rush are good for 4v4, frenzy for most 8v8.

glads defense would be good, but it stops you taking healing hands.

Symbolic Self
12-06-2006, 22:43
glads defense would be good, but it stops you taking healing hands.

OH GOD. TEH KITTANS!

I'm pretty sure you're joking but you really shouldn't say things like that. Someone might take you seriously.

Xunlai Agent
12-06-2006, 23:22
Yeah and when I use Glads Defense I can't combine Frenzy and Healing Signet :tongue:

cranialexodus
13-06-2006, 00:03
Yeah and when I use Glads Defense I can't combine Frenzy and Healing Signet :tongue:

funnily enough I saw someone try this particular combo in urgoz warrens today, against a wolf.

Yah I was kinda joking with the healing hands. Althougth I would generally take it over glads defense in pvp... I wouldn't take either. Killing kittens is good for the necros anyway, don't see anything to complain about there:cool:

gnarly
13-06-2006, 00:27
hey Symbolic are u actually going to suggest anything or are u just gonna carry on criticising.

battle rage is good btw

Tom Bombadil
13-06-2006, 01:13
hey Symbolic are u actually going to suggest anything or are u just gonna carry on criticising.

battle rage is good btw

I think it's funny. And btw, one way around the slow on shield stance is... to bring a bow!!!:laughing:

Buddah
13-06-2006, 02:10
Any non retarded enemy is going to target someone else once they see shield stance.
:rolleyes: Rigggghhhhhhhhhhhhht. Whatever. :rolleyes:

Wild Blow.

Symbolic Self
13-06-2006, 05:05
hey Symbolic are u actually going to suggest anything or are u just gonna carry on criticising.

Everything I would suggest has already been said. Rush/frenzy/sprint are all great in pvp. On the other hand people nominating stupid stuff like glad's defense and shield stance really shouldn't.


Rigggghhhhhhhhhhhhht. Whatever.

Wild Blow.

Lol. So I'm going to waste a slot on wild blow to drop a warrior who won't be able to catch anything anyway? Try again.

Samurai Jack
13-06-2006, 06:36
Any non retarded enemy is going to target someone else once they see shield stance. You've just wasted a slot on your bar by bringing it, and to make matters worse you've become completely useless in a fight since shield stance slows you down.

Maybe so, but it works. I survive much longer with it and it buys time, two importaint aspects in alliance battles. While everyone is too busy trying to kill me, my team has captured 2 outposts on the map. And that's why I bring a snare skill since I'm not moving very fast. =)

FireballX
13-06-2006, 06:57
Maybe so, but it works. I survive much longer with it and it buys time, two importaint aspects in alliance battles. While everyone is too busy trying to kill me, my team has captured 2 outposts on the map. And that's why I bring a snare skill since I'm not moving very fast. =)

Everyone in this thread has to remember that this is alliance battles we're talking about.

Not high level PvP. Alliance battles = total chaos = lots of idiots. So you can't take the for-granted that 'oo he put up a defense stance i'll hit someone else'. I saw a group made of 3 heavy tankers (PvE tank build) and a earth E/Mo spamming heals hold a rez shrine against ten of the enemy team. Ten. They should have attacked the other posts, but no, they're idiots.

Ryld Baenre
13-06-2006, 07:35
Everyone in this thread has to remember that this is alliance battles we're talking about.

Not high level PvP. Alliance battles = total chaos = lots of idiots. So you can't take the for-granted that 'oo he put up a defense stance i'll hit someone else'. I saw a group made of 3 heavy tankers (PvE tank build) and a earth E/Mo spamming heals hold a rez shrine against ten of the enemy team. Ten. They should have attacked the other posts, but no, they're idiots.


HHAAHAHA that's too awsome. I've never had anyone that dumb in any of the alliance battles I've done but the intelligence is certatinly lacking.

Samurai Jack
13-06-2006, 07:39
That's usually the turning point in the battle. If you or opposing team bunches up in an area of the map, then you're more likely to lose. I bet that the score of that game was 156 - 510. Wonder which side won that battle...anyways, if it was high level PvP, then yeah, defensive stances are out the window, but in alliance battles, it's always good for a warrior to invest some points into tactics or any defensive skills. Trust me, I held off ten guys at one point using Shield Stance and Melandru's Resiliance. We won that battle btw =).

Symbolic Self
13-06-2006, 08:56
Granted, sometimes you get opponents who are idiots. But I think you'd win anyway without running builds that specifically rely on their idiocy to work. After all, they're idiots right?

FireballX
13-06-2006, 09:03
Granted, sometimes you get opponents who are idiots. But I think you'd win anyway without running builds that specifically rely on their idiocy to work. After all, they're idiots right?

That's a given. I'm simply pointing out that alliance battles leave very large margins of build quality - bad builds or builds that don't fit PvP can still function somewhat effectively.

That being said, if I could organize a 12 man team into an organized version of an Alliance battle, I would take two tanking warriors. Why? Control point defense. A single tank can hold off an enemy zerg long enough to summon aid from the rest of the group, while in the meantime the 10 rampage through. Like Arathi Basin battles in WoW - alliance always left a paladin at flag points to mess with capture attempts and could stall for well over thirty seconds.

Buddah
13-06-2006, 15:20
Granted, sometimes you get opponents who are idiots. But I think you'd win anyway without running builds that specifically rely on their idiocy to work. After all, they're idiots right?
You mean those that think in 8 vs 8 and are completely unable to adjust to different circumstances, like combat in Alliance Battles but will openly refer to others as idiots.


Lol. So I'm going to waste a slot on wild blow to drop a warrior who won't be able to catch anything anyway? Try again.
:rolleyes: And when you need to remove him to take a control point. When you need to remove or deal with a touch ranger. Far from a wasted slot.

Symbolic Self
13-06-2006, 16:52
You mean those that think in 8 vs 8 and are completely unable to adjust to different circumstances, like combat in Alliance Battles but will openly refer to others as idiots.

I can adjust to circumstances just fine. I just don't like bad arguments (like yours). And don't get your panties in a bunch about the "idiots" term, I wasn't the one who used it first. Something you missed in your haste to take offense?

Regardless, people who do mass attack the warrior stacking defense buffs are idiots. That's a given. If you don't like that, tough, I'm not going to moderate my language to please you.


And when you need to remove him to take a control point. When you need to remove or deal with a touch ranger. Far from a wasted slot.

Why do I need to remove him to take a control point? If he's the last one there the control point will return towards my team naturally. Touch rangers can be dealt without wild blow. Snare, poison, and leave till last.

Nazpharoz
13-06-2006, 17:18
Everyone in this thread has to remember that this is alliance battles we're talking about.

Not high level PvP. Alliance battles = total chaos = lots of idiots. So you can't take the for-granted that 'oo he put up a defense stance i'll hit someone else'. I saw a group made of 3 heavy tankers (PvE tank build) and a earth E/Mo spamming heals hold a rez shrine against ten of the enemy team. Ten. They should have attacked the other posts, but no, they're idiots.

Had some fun today with zealot's fire + air of enchanted inside AB. around 5 warriors at a touch ranger while i spammed fast recherge and cast enchantments on that ranger. And yes, all died due to not changing target :grin:

I like myself also hte defensive stances. however also warriors endurance is also a nice stance when you use a lot off energy skills.

Buddah
13-06-2006, 19:37
Regardless, people who do mass attack the warrior stacking defense buffs are idiots. That's a given. If you don't like that, tough, I'm not going to moderate my language to please you.

BS. If it's all that is there, there is no reason not to take them out if it's possible. The idea is to strip them of their precious defense and quickly run them into the ground.

The only time I ever left a single warrior that liked stacking defensive skills was one that used Defy Pain, Dolyak, and Healing Hands, enough defense to stop any amount of melee damage. Waited for him to Dolyak and walked away. Saw him later at a rez shrine with no support. Seven people mugged the sob.

And I'm not saying rush a warrior first I'm just specifing on a way for a Warrior to take down stance users. Wild Blow does that job. It also helps slow down runners as well. I frequently run in warrior heavy groups in ABs where one of us can spare a spot for Wild Blow.

Why do I need to remove him to take a control point? If he's the last one there the control point will return towards my team naturally. And as you walk away he'll start on the NPC's and eventually start to reclaim the point. Besides as long as they are there it'll slow the capping of the point. Best to make sure you have the point with no opponents left before moving on.

This doesn't mean fighting a hopeless battle. But if you can clear a point quickly, do so.


Touch rangers can be dealt without wild blow. Snare, poison, and leave till last.I hate this arguement, so generalized. Most warrior and ranger snares and ways to poison are iffy at best (except for traps) when dealing with a touch ranger.

Ryld Baenre
13-06-2006, 22:58
I've played a touch ranger in AB and found snares/poison totally useless when used against me. There's a reason they carry plague touch and 100% of the time you just toss it on an enemy and keep moving. It doesn't slow you down at all. The only useful "snare" against them is hex spells that slow movement which I have never seen used in Ab anyway.

FireballX
13-06-2006, 23:00
I've played a touch ranger in AB and found snares/poison totally useless when used against me. There's a reason they carry plague touch and 100% of the time you just toss it on an enemy and keep moving. It doesn't slow you down at all. The only useful "snare" against them is hex spells that slow movement which I have never seen used in Ab anyway.

In AB there's always someone nearby to plague touch. Not so in GvG where people run away.

And I did take an illusion mesmer into AB to mess around. So that's one person.

Symbolic Self
14-06-2006, 19:09
BS. If it's all that is there, there is no reason not to take them out if it's possible. The idea is to strip them of their precious defense and quickly run them into the ground.

"If possible". If you have someone with (for example) large amounts of armor ignoring damage by all means take out that defense stacking warrior. That doesn't mean it's a good idea to carry wild blow for the express purpose of killing someone who isn't a threat to your team and is only a mild threat to npcs, there are better things to do with that slot.

Wild blow is much better on assassins anyway. They don't use adrenaline and they get energy back for crits.

And I can't think of a plausible reason why 7 people should be attacking that stancer. That's almost two whole teams!

If you're behind or only slightly ahead, people should be out capping points. If you're way ahead...well then it really doesn't matter does it?


And as you walk away he'll start on the NPC's and eventually start to reclaim the point. Besides as long as they are there it'll slow the capping of the point. Best to make sure you have the point with no opponents left before moving on.

People who use glad's, dolyaks, shield stance, etc generally have crap damage output. It will take them a while to kill off the npcs, and by then someone else on your team will probably be along to stop him.

If you're seriously worried about this problem, don't take a warrior. Take an anti-warrior mesmer or a blood or curses necro or whatever.


I hate this arguement, so generalized. Most warrior and ranger snares and ways to poison are iffy at best (except for traps) when dealing with a touch ranger.

Cripshot. Water hexes. Mesmer snares. All are effective ways to completely nullify a touch ranger. And cripshotters and water elementalists generally offer a tremendous amount of utility in any case, so it's not as if you're devoting a character specifically to stop touchers.

There's absolutely no reason for a warrior to take on this job, they're not suited to it and there are better things they could be doing.




In AB there's always someone nearby to plague touch. Not so in GvG where people run away.

I don't find that to be the case at all. Quite often you'll find yourself in a situation where you're contesting another team for a node-in that case provided your team can kite cripshot will prevent the toucher from using plague touch.

If you're in the huge mess at the center then yeah...conditions aren't going to be all that useful. But you shouldn't be there in most cases.

Arutima
14-06-2006, 19:34
Everyone in this thread has to remember that this is alliance battles we're talking about.

Not high level PvP. Alliance battles = total chaos = lots of idiots. So you can't take the for-granted that 'oo he put up a defense stance i'll hit someone else'. I saw a group made of 3 heavy tankers (PvE tank build) and a earth E/Mo spamming heals hold a rez shrine against ten of the enemy team. Ten. They should have attacked the other posts, but no, they're idiots.



or even funnier : 4 n/mo FoC spiker killing 4-5 ppl in one spike in saltspray's middle, when everyone are fighting for it

Buddah
14-06-2006, 19:42
And I can't think of a plausible reason why 7 people should be attacking that stancer. That's almost two whole teams!

Maybe you should think on it more. Guy rezzes before a shrine is taken, finds he's the only one there.



People who use glad's, dolyaks, shield stance, etc generally have crap damage output. It will take them a while to kill off the npcs, and by then someone else on your team will probably be along to stop him.
Another poor generalization.

These same guys can have 4 or 5 attack skills, 14-16 into their weapon, a self heal, a single defensive skill and really pack a punch. These are more than able to quickly solo NPC rangers, warriors, and monks. This is especially true in AB where Rez Sigs aren't needed freeing up an extra slot. The addition of a defensive skill doesn't always mean noticably less damage output.

Secondly, in AB don't count on the other 8 players to do anything. Too many AFKs, people fighting hopeless battles, glory hunters off solo, or those that have no idea what the mechanics of the AB are. This is why I favor leaving control points solidly under control before moving on.

Symbolic Self
14-06-2006, 22:48
Maybe you should think on it more. Guy rezzes before a shrine is taken, finds he's the only one there.

Maybe you should read the damn thread? This isn't about one guy occasionally rezzing in the midst of a bunch of enemies, this is about 7 people purposefully attacking a "tank" fruitlessly for quite a while.

Yeah, that's a real strong argument for taking defensive stances into battle, or attacking tanks in general. :rolleyes:



Another poor generalization.


Oh please. The FACT is that stance stackers generally DO have poor damage output because they're usually PvE tanking builds made for soaking damage. Are you seriously contesting this?



These same guys can have 4 or 5 attack skills, 14-16 into their weapon, a self heal, a single defensive skill and really pack a punch. These are more than able to quickly solo NPC rangers, warriors, and monks. This is especially true in AB where Rez Sigs aren't needed freeing up an extra slot. The addition of a defensive skill doesn't always mean noticably less damage output.

They can but they almost always don't. You can't claim this


Secondly, in AB don't count on the other 8 players to do anything. Too many AFKs, people fighting hopeless battles, glory hunters off solo, or those that have no idea what the mechanics of the AB are.

and then on the other side of your mouth go on about how hypothetically a defensive stance user could kill NPCs quickly (something which never happens). Make up your mind, are we talking about ABs as they are, or ABs as we wish they would be?

MaximumSquid
15-06-2006, 01:05
Sprint is the most used.

I'll just put my money on that one

neoflame
15-06-2006, 01:26
Sprint is the most used.

I'll just put my money on that one
Depends on whether or not you count PvE, and bad players. If you exclude both, 95% will be using Frenzy, but people will be divided between Rush and Sprint.

Buddah
15-06-2006, 04:18
Maybe you should read the damn thread? This isn't about one guy occasionally rezzing in the midst of a bunch of enemies, this is about 7 people purposefully attacking a "tank" fruitlessly for quite a while.No, you should read it closer. You wanted a reason why people would kill a stancer, I gave you one and now you go off on a tangent. Time wise, no big deal, 5 or 6 seconds for 7 people to handle a single person who was all defense.



Oh please. The FACT is that stance stackers generally DO have poor damage output because they're usually PvE tanking builds made for soaking damage. Are you seriously contesting this?

They can but they almost always don't. You can't claim this
Neither can you rule it out.



and then on the other side of your mouth go on about how hypothetically a defensive stance user could kill NPCs quickly (something which never happens). Make up your mind, are we talking about ABs as they are, or ABs as we wish they would be?Is this another wild tangent you're going off on? What you quote and what you rant about have no real correlation. Explain how taking advantage of the AI of NPCs and unreliabilty of human teammates is one and the same.

Arctus Redryn
15-06-2006, 05:27
These same guys can have 4 or 5 attack skills, 14-16 into their weapon, a self heal, a single defensive skill and really pack a punch. These are more than able to quickly solo NPC rangers, warriors, and monks. This is especially true in AB where Rez Sigs aren't needed freeing up an extra slot. The addition of a defensive skill doesn't always mean noticably less damage output.


Not to enter this argument or anything, but having only one defensive skill will save you (if at all) for a few seconds, which is quite insignificant. A person focusing on taking out a Warrior will not be deflected by one defensive skill.

Consider also that having more damage often means taking out foes more quickly, which results in less damage received.

FireballX
15-06-2006, 05:28
Not to enter this argument or anything, but having only one defensive skill will save you (if at all) for a few seconds, which is quite insignificant. A person focusing on taking out a Warrior will not be deflected by one defensive skill.

Consider also that having more damage often means taking out foes more quickly, which results in less damage received.

Counter-argument is that a single defensive skill can keep you alive long enough to get that last strike on someone to kill them.

But honestly, just run with what you're most comfortable with in Alliance Battles. It doesn't matter.

Arctus Redryn
15-06-2006, 05:58
Counter-argument is that a single defensive skill can keep you alive long enough to get that last strike on someone to kill them.


Or, you could use Frenzy instead of that defensive stance, or another attack skill, to inflict that last strike before you perish...



But honestly, just run with what you're most comfortable with in Alliance Battles. It doesn't matter.

Well...agreed...tis only Alliance Battles, which are a far cry from organized PvP.