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Servant of Kali
19-07-2006, 14:38
Foreword

Annoyed with the people who keep complaining how Kurzick side is impossible, and how in 99% battles they lose, i decided to attempt to write this guide. Now, honestly speaking, i play Luxon side most of the time, but not because it's easier. I don't like farming too much, even though i do it here and there. Thus, winning fast (5-10 min) on Luxon side is my source of both fun but also of money. On Kurzick side, you need to wait 20min to get same faction you can get on Luxon side for 5min of gameplay. This needs to be balanced, and hopefully ANet will slightly increase the faction Kurzick side gets for winning. Until that happens, i don't see myself playing Kurzick side more than Luxon, at least until i get enough money.

First of all please understand this guide isnt perfect. It's limited by my knowledge of the matter. It is also limited by the fact that this is pvp arena, with the dynamic aspect it brings. Look at it more as a scetch which i hope others will perfect more and more.

Seconds of all, im not trying to prove here that sides are balanced. They are not. When two groups of average pvers face each other, Luxon side will win. But this guide isnt for pvers anyway. It's for those who always strive to improve their pvp skills. It's not for those who keep whinning how Luxon side is easier, and how all's hopeless. I don't like whinning. I prefer being constructive instead and contribute to a problem if anyhow possible.

Third, if there's a leecher in your team, just rage-quit. Yes yes, you can win with leecher, but it's not worth the risk, and it's not worth giving the guy full faction. Im saddened with ANets indifference towards leechers, and how Gaile even says to us not to bother reporting em because nothing will happen (which is true because i tried). I myself won't bother much with Kurzick side until Anet does something with leechers. It's better to exploit it; play as Luxon and win in 5min every time because Kurzicks had 1-2+ leechers. Oh joy :) However, if you're one of those masochistic people, then read further :P

Fourth - if there are people who don't know how to play the map, give them a kind advice. If there are still people who repeatedly keep messing up because they are too stuborn - ragequit. Yes that's right, it's a team game. No team, no win. Not even on Luxon side can you afford to have problematic kids, and trust me you can afford it even less on Kurzick side. Remember that this is a military. If someone has authority problem, he shouldnt pvp. He can use henchies and do pve missions, but if you have authority problem dont pvp. It's not for you. Im not saying that you should suck up insults, but if your ego is too sensitive to take well-meant constructive criticism, dont play pvp. Dunnot under any circumstances type lines such as "dont tell me how to play this game". A great player will always like hints, because they improve his knowledge and skill. That's how you learn to play this game. When you see someone saying "dont tell me how to play this game", you're dealing with a noob who will always stay noob. Dont waste time bothering with him, just ragequit.



Overall strategy

Mission objective: protect Architect for 20min.

Keep this in mind all the time. Your goal is NOT to kill as many Luxon players as possible. If you want to have fun with that, this is not the arena for you. Try Random Arena.

Strategic approach:
1) Fortifying - Bond Monks
2) Stalling - Ritual Lords with defensive spirits, Stance Tanks and alike
3) Disruption - Rangers and Mesmers with turtle interrupts
4) Haste - speed boosts on warriors, rangers etc


Before you enter the mission, you need to have a build made for a specific goal. DUNNOT bring a random build. Every skill down to the last needs to have exact purpose on this map. When you enter the Fort, you need to know exactly what you're going to do, from the very beginning. Are you amber runner? Are you protecting inside the fort? There are way too many warriors who join in, and then idle inside the Fort. The excuses such as "sorry lag.." are irrelevant. If you have such a lag that it makes the map properly unplayable, why join and spoil the mission for others?

Last but not the least - team coordination. If you're covering 1 gate, let your team know so they can cover the other gate. Are both gates covered? Let everyone know they should focus on running amber. Is there EoE around, but you're caster and can't kill it as fast with a wand? Call the target, several times if needed. Draw a circle around it on minimap. Sometimes it's difficult to find the spirit in the chaos of the battle. Make it easier for your team.


Running Amber and controlling mines

Without running amber, winning is nearly impossible (unless ur lucky to have 2 bond monks and no luxon with enchant removal).

As soon as the battle starts, go through one of the portals (with few others hopefully), get the mine, and run amber back to the Gatekeeper. Rinse repeat. That's the basic :) Now for the fun parts. Use mines to stall. If your build can solo mine guardians, keep reconquering them. Just pls dont bother with this if you're a ranger with longbow who _can_ solo mines, but it takes him 5 min to do so. There are enough of builds who can kill mine guardians very fast, so allow them to do it. It's not needed to have both mines, you only need one to run amber. However, as said earlier, if you run a specific fun build to smack NPCs at the mine, that's ok.

Use run boosts. If you're warrior or assassin, or even a ranger, it's not a problem to take run skill.


Fighting outside

If you're lucky to have noob Luxons, this is one of the easiest ways to win as Kurzick. Your intention is to draw as many luxons (or even luxon warriors) to you, and then let them chase you. Remember, you dont need to kill them. Each minute they spend chasing you, is minute they are not conquering the fort. It doesnt matter if you die, but how much time you steal. Just make sure that you do more benefit than drawback. It doesnt pay off much to keep 1 luxon busy. It's a waste. Keeping 2+ is good.

Aside of running, the other types of fighting outside include pure stalling. Stance tanks will take a while to go down in most cases. Again, doesnt matter if you die, but how long you survive. Remember all those infamous WMo's from Random Arena? Well, they actually have a purpose here :)

Touch rangers are good for this.

To kill Orange and Purple Commanders or not to kill? I'm not sure if i know the answer. I'd say it depends on the situation. If your team has enough anti-turtle skills, this isnt needed. If you have some fun solo build which can kill NPCs fast, you can do this along with conquering mines. If nothing else, killing Commanders will make more chaos on Luxon side. Watch out for invasion forces. If there are a lot of Luxons in the fort, and both turtles alive, it's better to suicide, spawn inside, and kill invaders who breached in. There is really no point in soloing people outside while Gunther is getting creamed.

The biggest mistake that you can do is helping others to kill Commanders, or non-primary mine points. Look, let me make this clear. If i use solo build which can take out these points alone, the last thing i need is you to waste time coming all the way down here, and "help" me kill them. Even after i repeat it 10x, some people still dont get it. By "helping" me, you're actually hurting the whole team. So, next time you see someone soloing these points, move along. If he cant kill them, or cant kill fast enough, that's his problem.

Always be aware of the movement of the enemy. You need to be at the right place at the right time. Too many Luxons on purple gate? It really doesnt make much sense to try and conquer purple mine. Switch over.

Avoid turtles. While you're outside you are very vulnerable to turtle fire. They have good range and do a lot of dmg.


Stalling inside

Monk should bond 1 NPC on the outer gate. If lucky and no one on Luxon side can counter enchants, the gate is probably safe for the duration of whole battle.

Protection Ritualist is 2nd most important class. While it cant fully protect the gate from getting breached, as bond monk can, Rt can greatly stall the invasion. You camp just a bit away from the wall edge, and spam spirits. Ritual Lord + Boon of Creation + Shelter + Union + Displacement + Signet of Creation (signet is awesome). This is the core. You can try with Recuperation, and you can also bring Symbiosis. If lucky to have prot monk, this helps greatly in endgame.

Interrupt ranger and mesmers can stall turtle progress, and do other effects.


Saving Gunther

EoE is your biggest enemy. Almost always it is placed on the outer side of the wall, left or right of the Green Gate. Always, always make EoE priority. Dont go on killing that turtle or enemy players if EoE is up. Get EoE. I cannot stress how important this is. Yes, i have myself lost games because of EoE, but only once because we were unlucky and it triggered too fast. All other times i've lost it because no one knew what EoE is, where is it, or simply bothered to kill it. Spirit Walk on assassin can work wonders, if you can afford that skill. If not, just babysit the ranger (or anyone else) who has EoE. Having interrupt of any kind is great. Mesmer, if any points in domination line, should have Unnatural Signet. It's worth it. Yes, it does kill fast enough no matter what some will say.

Just ignore the fairytales of how EoE is unfair and overpowered. Instead, kill it. And kill it on time. Sure, if you leave it there for 30+ sec you will most likely lose the battle. But then it's your fault anyhow. The same thing is with turtles.. yea sure they are powerful, but instead of whinning and being helpless, counter it. A turtle is NPC, it has AI. Exploit it.

At times of crises, Symbiosis + prot spells works wonders. Unfortunately, it requires 2 players; a prot monk, and someone with the spirit. But it can work great. Still, i would not rely on this, and it's always best to plan on not having Luxons get this far.


Profession builds

Monk. Any monk is great. Bonder monk is the best, because it only has one weakness but most of the time it's totally worth it.

Ritualist. Should have RLord and defensive spirits. The second choice is Khanei one who can solo mines, luxon warriors and others outside. Still, i'd rather have RLord one. Rt with offensive spirits isnt good. Yes, i have played it. It's too vulnerable to turtle fire. If you want to play this kind of Rt, they are awesome on Luxon side.

Warrior. Put run skill(s) and keep getting that amber. Or make stance tank and stall em outside. More time they waste killing u, closer to victory you are. Put one interrupt such as distracting blow.

Assassin. AoD works great, but im not expert in assassin so maybe someone else could give more input. Aspenwood is great for assassins who know how to play. Lots of solo people whom you can jump and smack before they know what hit them. Pick those who do the most dmg. If you can take out minion master, do it. Take out fire ele. Take out monk. Dont bother soloing people just for the sake of soloing. Always think how you can contribute the most. It's not good to kill someone who just spawned, since when you kill him he'll spawn at the same place few sec later.

Ranger. Interrupts for turtle. Run skills for amber (or both of course). Touch rangers are great. I see a lot of rangers standing on the outer wall, shooting with longbow. I guess it works, but take the right skills.

Necromancer. Spiteful spirit ownz Luxon warriors. Especially when they are grouped around your gate NPCs. I would advise against MM if you're Kurzick. Turtles can smash minions. I think AoE degen such as Suffering works nicely too.

Elementalist. I honestly have no idea :) But considering the battles can be quite crowded, i'd go with AoE spells.

Mesmer. Degens, turtle interrupts.. all work. Perhaps even Crippling Anguish for turtles, but i have no experience with mesmer in Aspenwood so need more input here.

upier
19-07-2006, 15:11
Thank you. More ppl need to read this.
Also another older thread that covers some of the things is:
FA - strategy talk (http://forums.gwonline.net/showthread.php?t=405721).

Some more advice:
be kind - say hello when you start - it shows manners and you see if the team is able to comunicate.
if there are ppl that dont move from the starting position - you ask if they will play, then tell that you will leave if they refuse to play. you can quote me :wink: - 'sorry but i have a rule that i leave if there are more than 2 afks' - when the timer stops and they dont move - i say bye, and leave- no need to worry. you might have to repeat this more than once in a row but hey - you would waste time either way. last night some of us kept quitting (we followed my rule) till we finally got a team where no one was afk. we lost a few matches, we won a few - but we had fun.

Servant of Kali
19-07-2006, 15:57
Actually, i would be a bit more patience on afk people. When initial time runs out, give them a minute or two. If they still dont move quit. It's quite possible that they are running GW in the background while waiting for mission to start. Happens to me as well from time to time. Later on, you will already know who is leeching and who isnt, because most leechers do it 24/7.


I would also like to add few more things - if you have pve monk, or ritualist, use him on kurzick side. It will mean much more to the team than going in this battle with a warrior for instance. A team with no monk or ritualist will have very very difficult time winning. This is part of the imbalance. Luxons have more choices of good team setup, while Kurzicks dont. Unfortunately im not able to bring a solution to the problem, aside of more people going here with monk or Rt, or any defensive build. After all, remember that ur defending. You dont need to kill a single person. Your goal is to stay alive.

There is a reason why some people say they win 99% of time on Luxon side, and a reason why when i play with Rt on Kurzick side i have either winning streaks, or i still win more than lose. It's not a coincidence. Kurzick side does require effort, correct build and strategic approach, but it's not as imbalanced as people claim. 1 person can make a huge difference.

Archenine Paranoia
19-07-2006, 16:24
One of the most important things is that heavy degen has almost no counter in disorganised PVP. Swamp them with it. I cannot stress how much damage a blood/curses Necro can do with Life Syphon/Faintheartedness/Suffering/OoB can inflict. Without proper hex removal, you inflict major carnage throughout their entire team.

Servant of Kali
19-07-2006, 17:44
Not just that. I might be wrong, but i think turtles are especially vulnerable to degen. They have that resistance skill (non-critical hits....), i dont know if it's just physical dmg or ele too. But in any case degening seems to work so much better.

Serendipity
19-07-2006, 17:57
16 in illusion
Clumsiness
Ineptitude
conjure Phantasm
image of remorse
image of attrition

As a mesmer you can retake a mine hold by the Luxons archer under 15 seconds. If you just do that, Luxons will lose a lot of time trying to retake the mine.

The nice things about this build is that even if there is Luxons players defending the mine, most of the time you have the time to cast all your spells, even if you die right afterward it is not a big deal, you can just rush back in time to retake it or take the other one. :)

Death Sigma
19-07-2006, 18:07
Very nice guide! Just a few things I would like to add to it:

-If the Luxons have penetrated the Inner Gates, break through the Green Gate, then start harassing Gunther, do NOT have 4-5 people standing there with amber! 1-2 people is perfect, since the minute they are out of the gate you can go right to repairing, but anymore than 2 is a problem. If you aren't an amber runner, drop the amber for now and fend off the enemy.

-EoE is NOT your friend! Kill that thing ASAP! Same goes with Nature's Renewal, while it won't kill anyone, it sure kills using enchants, which defensive Kurzicks need. I find if you leave EoE up for even 10 seconds you lose. Good thing you mentioned this. :)

-In the beggining, I find most people rush the Purple Mine first, and for good reason: the Luxons tend to storm the Orange Gate first, and having the team focus on the Purple Mine to bring in amber is a good start. If the Luxons decide to storm the Purple side first, then have a few casters stay back and draw aggro while the runners rush in amber.

-Like OP said, pray to God you have a bonder monk. Especially good ones, I've seen 1 bonder monk keep Gunther and the 2 Gatekeepers alive the entire match (however, NOT when EoE is up)

-Like another said, degen is very effective against the turtles. I've been able (as a Necromancer) to solo kill turtles very quickly. The only way a turtle survives really is if someone is healing it.

-Do NOT go after the commanders! I find once teammates start going after comanders we start to lose. If someone is specially designed fo the task, and we aren't losing TOO badly, then by all means, but ONLY when we have a steady defence up should you start sending people after commanders.

-Keep both Mines at ALL COSTS. I can't stress this enough, people think that you only need 1 really, but your WRONG. You can still run amber with 1, but Luxons spawning at those points is DEADLY, ABSOLUTELY DEADLY. If you can keep both mines, chances are you have a good shot at winning (plus being able to run amber from either side or both sides is great).

-Luxon Warriors are a beotch, plain and simple. KD sucks, and having 4 of them on you sucks too. However, as long as they are running around, the enemy cannot respawn more unless both groups die (including turtles). So if the turtles are dead but a few Warriors are running around, let them. Without the turtle the Luxons are very prone to gate repair.

-Spirits are great to use here. Any Rit defensive spirit really (I find Soothing slows down the Luxon Warriors alot) and Ranger spirits such as Symbiosis and Fertile Season, just be careful with Range Spirits ;)

-Also on leechers: we know they suck, they DO suck, they obviously have nothing better to do than to waste peoples time losing with them on their team. If you absolutely can't shake leechers, play with 1, and ONLY 1. 2 or more leechers spell doom for you, so just ragequit. Personally, I ragequit when theres just 1 after the first few minutes UNLESS we have a real good team or the Luxons have more leechers, etc.

rentauri
19-07-2006, 18:43
Nice guide, has some great points espically this:

"EoE is your biggest enemy."

While it ture EoE CAN be used to stall it kills your npcs as well as the enemies and that is bad mojo. I dont know how many times Ive seen a Kurzick ranger use this spirit INSIDE the Green Gate after a breach.

An intereting killer luxon tactic Ive seen is a luxon streaks in casts EoE as close to the green gate as possible followed by and MM and a couple of tanks. In the resulting battle alot of stuff is leveled and the green gate generally falls. They then streak in to Gunther and repeat.

For Elementalists it is my primary build. Fire and Airis is were the money is in Aspenwood. Not that you cant have a good water or earth build you can. Fire is prefect for clearing gates and mines and some with burning you get a nice degen. I dont know how man times I destroyed mine guards with an Arcane Echo + Firestorm. Air is amazing not simply because of the spike potential but becuase many of its spells dont require LoS. Monk bonding a gate? Cant see him but can reach him with spells well Lighting Hammer, Lighting Strike and the like can.

"Ranger. Interrupts for turtle. Run skills for amber (or both of course). Touch rangers are great. I see a lot of rangers standing on the outer wall, shooting with longbow. I guess it works, but take the right skills."

I would be one. I use a Flatbow for the higher arch, it allows me to clear some structures that many block a shot. About Touch Rangers, I dont like the only because they seem to be a dime a dozen now, they have a serious advantage on the Luxon side. Becuase the gate guards, mine guards, gatebuilders and guther are all staticit is really easy to long on and kill them.

Ashin
19-07-2006, 19:26
One point that should be emphasized regarding mines - in addition to the benefit of receiving amber from them, the secondary benefit is that while you control a mine, Luxons will not be able to spawn there. Therefore they have a longer run back. Ergo, more time for you to clean up NPC's in your fort before their return. Etc.

I do not suggest having someone actually guard the mines, but rather make it a point to conquer them as frequently as you can.

In my experience Rt Lord can definitely stall the enemy, but as you say its not true safety, just delay. I also bring Dissonance, because its very rare to see an interrupting ranger or mes in FA. I plant it up on the wall to the side. Sometimes it decides to target a Luxon Warrior instead, and this is ever frustrating. But sometimes it DOES target the siege turtle, and with RL and Boon of Creation you can actually keep that trutle disrupted for quite a while, assuming Dissonance cooperates. :rolleyes:

upier
19-07-2006, 20:25
after a day of ragequitting and getting just the worst ppl ever ive moved to the luxon side. in one hour ive farmed half the faction that ive farmed all day on the kurzik side. went in - degened the kurzicks to death, put up eoe and watched them hunt me outside of the fort, go after anyone and nobody running amber and nobody taking down eoe.they got wiped - several times. so now i am luxon and i laugh at the stupidety of the kurzicks.
so this guide is evil. EVIL i say and should be deleted :grin:

Servant of Kali
19-07-2006, 21:16
Upier - i am well aware of that. It's one of the many reasons why im not playing Kurzick side. I as well prefer to leech on people stupidity, and benefit from it. Dont know what EoE is? Cool, instead of explaining it to every team, i go Luxon and win in 5min.

Anet needs to take care of leechers AND increase the amount of faction Kurzick get for win. It HAS to be more than Luxon side. Without that i dont see myself playing Kurzick. Which doesnt mean i cant write a guide for poor fellows :)


In my experience Rt Lord can definitely stall the enemy, but as you say its not true safety, just delay. I also bring Dissonance

RLord can stall the enemy enough for them to lose the battle. I was merely making a comparison to bond monk. Dissonance is bad for several reasons but if it works for u, great. I dont use it. Not that i didnt try it but the chances of hitting the turtle are small. Also, if no one down there is shooting the turtle, spirit might not hit as well. On the wall, you might be just a tiny bit outside of turtle range.. so.. bummer. turtle hits you and there goes your spirit. Also, where on earth do you find enough energy to spam 2 dissonance per 1 min? :P Again, if it works for u cool heh.. i tried it and didnt like it.

Dravyn
19-07-2006, 21:18
I absolutely love Aspenwood, that being the closest thing to battlegrounds that GW has to offer. However, I do have some issues with Kurzick, which is what I always play.

NPC's - Luxon NPC's are highly aggressive, whereas Kurz npc's are not. Kurz npc's will stand in one spot and let a ranged attacker - player/turtle, etc - kill them with no resistance. One cast from range on a luxon npc will have that npc or its mobile guard *cough* siege turtle* cough* charging into the fight. Its not only the luxon warriors that act this way, the priests and commanders will charge from their spawns for a certain distance to react to threat. Also, luxon npc's have some self healing/healers, ours don't, except for one I think in the green room. None of the gate guards heal.

Siege Turtle - Great concept, but some things about it irritiate me. Point blank siege firing capability..retarded. Spammable 100+ dmg carrier defense w/knockdown and knockback..retarded. Had a turtle last night hit me three times in a row with carrier defense for 100 dmg each hit and THEN fire its cannon right into its own face to kill me. I could see having all that if it didn't have a mobile defensive contingent, but it does, which is highly aggressive. Our only answer to siege turtles in the form of an npc is one lumbering behemoth that moves at the speed of snail and seems to attack twice as slow as it moves. That thing is about worthless.

Respawning NPCs- auto respawn for luxon, amber generated respawn for us..if the gatekeepers are fighting, there's no turning in amber, ie, no respawning npcs. Bad design imo. Once luxon's get to the gates and have killed your npc's, you're left with only the 8 players on your team to contend with their 8 players, their 8 luxon warriors, and their two siege turtles. Because all of theirs automatically respawn.

Other than that, I think its awesome :D Oh, and I absolutely despise rage quitters about as much as afk leechers.

Servant of Kali
19-07-2006, 22:35
Juggernaut is useless... i agree. I have never seen that thing do any real dmg. Moves so slow that you can simply walk around it. Since it doesnt have ranged attack, the only thing that should be scared by it are luxon warrior (if they target it) and turtle. And even then lol...

Harshateja
20-07-2006, 02:32
I play a kurzick bonder so I do have some background when making this radical mark:

Its very difficult for a kurzick team to win against a team with both a disenchanter and EoE. Though those times are far and few between, the chance for it to even happen has made me stop visiting aspenwood.

The only way I see to balance Aspenwood without changing the scenario or npc stats or etc is to make it a team arena so that there can be more defensive coordination.

Servant of Kali
20-07-2006, 10:11
Actually, i still stand by what i said - give Kurzick side more faction when they win. That will solve the imbalance as good players will have a reason to actually play Kurzicks. Right now i need money, so cant be bothered with 20min battles when i get the same amount of faction in 5min on luxon side. Rinse repeat.

Oh, and until leechers issue is addressed by Anet, i cant be bothered either (considering the amount of leechers especially on kurzick side).

These are the true issues, NOT imbalance itself.

Kalis Pax
20-07-2006, 12:38
Oh, and until leechers issue is addressed by Anet, i cant be bothered either (considering the amount of leechers especially on kurzick side).

These are the true issues, NOT imbalance itself.

Agreed. I was on one team yesterday that had 4 leechers. I hope they enjoyed their ill-gained faction.

Sir Jack
20-07-2006, 19:21
Juggernaut is useless... i agree. I have never seen that thing do any real dmg. Moves so slow that you can simply walk around it. Since it doesnt have ranged attack, the only thing that should be scared by it are luxon warrior (if they target it) and turtle. And even then lol...

If the Juggernaut uses his Juggernaut Toss on the Turtle, his Turtle shell stance is removed for 5 seconds and all attacks seem to be critical. Dealt pathetically low damage with turtle shell on as my ranger (degen with Apply poison though), then hit 2-3 arrows dealing 60 damage. close to 100 when I used Melandru's.

Only use I've seen for the Juggernaut though, and since I'm usually fighting on Luxon side, I completely screw him since I can just walk away when he comes too close.

Servant of Kali
20-07-2006, 21:29
Oh come on, juggernaut will take forever to reach turtle.. by that time turtle is probably gonna kill everyone around, so how many in reality are left standing and can shoot at turtle? :) It all sounds good, but most of the time juggernaut dies before even reaching the turtle.

Ashin
21-07-2006, 06:39
(1) about the Juggernaut - its like all our npcs - totally pointless and weak UNLESS it has a dedicated player trying to preserve it. His purpose, imo, is to make a siege turtle easier to kill if you are having trouble doing so.

(2) about Dissonance Kali - I agree with everything you said. Huge energy cost, absolutely pitiful AI, and there is simply no way (I have been experimenting extensively) to place it where you will ensure it will target the turtle. However, roughly once or twice per match I get it to target a turtle. And when it does, its a huge payoff imo. If an outer gate is just broken, typically you have some touchers or aoe'ers coming in.. heck even a warrior with healing sig.. none of these folks appreciates getting targetted by Dissonance. So.. for me it is worth it. I don't spam it certainly, but I do deploy it at times and hope for the best.

(3) About Rit Lords in RA - I continue to be impressed with just how much you can contribute to a Kurzick victory as a Rit Lord spamming protection. I have found that with just ONE keeping one side safe (very slow to get through), and THREE people devoted to running amber, you have very good odds of victory. Those are my numbers that I run by. First second I'm in FA I ask who is running amber. Typically one person responds. I tell the group we need three. If I don't hear immediate replies I can be almost certain we will lose. If I hear replies we usually win. Which brings me to another point that I think Kali is trying to get across also..

(4) If you are going to FA as a Kurzick, knowing the odds are somewhat against you, and that your faction gain is slow even if you win, please consider coming with a build that is useful in FA. I don't care if you can kill players well. To be honest, I think you could win FA without killing any players. Please understand that this instance is *barely* a pvp instance for Kurzick. You need to be able to:

a) protect npcs (imo rit lord is ideal, monks of course do well pending build)

b) run amber / capture mine (as Kali said if you intend to capture mines you need to be able to do this solo and quickly, unless there are other players present.. in any event 2-3 amber runners that move as a group is best)

c) interrupt siege turtle attacks / kill siege turtle (to be honest I am shocked at how many rangers arrive at FA and tell me they are not capable of a single interrupt)

d) pre-occupy luxon warriors by tanking them (W/Mo here is your time to shine!)

To be totally blunt and honest, if you are not doing one of these four things, I don't care what you are doing. You are not really helping your team to win. Changing build is very easy to do and actually interesting to see all facets of your profession. I know it sounds elitist or condescending, but now that I understand the impact rit lord can have on FA, I kind of roll my eyes at all the rits that come there with their uber channeling spike builds. Please..

I don't find spamming shelter/union/displacement especially thrilling.. but I do prefer winning to losing. Since I switched to ritual lord in FA I find that I win roughly half my games. All depends on whether we have three people that understand how to run amber, to be honest. Three people plus me slowing down progress at one gate is enough to win in most cases.

Before when I came as channeling I won I'd say about 10% of the time. Coincidence? I'm not patting myself on the back. Its just the difference between doing something useless (killing players that instantly respawn) vs doing something useful (keeping npcs and gates alive significantly longer).

So think about these tasks, and which one you'd like to do / would be best at, and please come with a build that can do one of these tasks well imo. Frankly even if your build could kill any other player in one hit, it still wouldn't do much to win a game of FA for Kurzick side. It might sound harsh, but that's just the reality of this map as I see it.

Amadei
21-07-2006, 07:47
Elementalist. I honestly have no idea :) But considering the battles can be quite crowded, i'd go with AoE spells.

I run a boring little flashbot as an ele in Fort Aspenwood - Blinding Flash and Enervating Charge make for completely useless warriors, assassins and rangers. I also bring Gale for interrupting purposes (it doesn't interrupt the turtle, as far as I know, but it's fairly spammable -- mind the exhaustion! -- and once I find out who the EoE spammer is, s/he won't be safe :P), and dual attunement (which sucks if you have Luxon enchant strippers, but there aren't too many of those running around). Playing a flashbot also makes for easy mine-grabbing; blind Luxon longbows are Luxon longbows that pose no threat.


Mesmer. Degens, turtle interrupts.. all work. Perhaps even Crippling Anguish for turtles, but i have no experience with mesmer in Aspenwood so need more input here.

I play a Migraine/interrupt mesmer at FA. Migraine, three interrupts, including Signet of Disruption for the turtle/EoE bot, some degen and Distortion for protection from the Luxon NPC warrior squad.

Bonder monks are your best friend on the Kurzick side. I synced my entrance with two bonder monks a few times last night and we won every time because either the Luxons had no enchant removal, or not enough (I saw a dom mesmer with Shatter Enchant, which is great, but won't suffice because the bondee will have more than one enchant on him). Note that if you have a bonder monk, s/he will be VERY pissed if you open the green gate if all the Luxons are pounding on that last Kurzick elementalist. Do Not Do This, Ever.

The Juggernaut is fairly useless. I play FA Kurzick a lot (like, a LOT. It's funded three 15k armors so far, by gaining faction and selling the amber) and I've seen the Juggernaut turn over a turtle... once.

The biggest cause for a Kurzick loss is people not running amber and not holding mines. The group starts out by getting the purple mine and running back some amber to fix the orange gates, which are usually both down by the time you get back. Then the Kurzicks play like a Luxon, i.e. they go on a mad killing spree and stop running amber. And then we lose.

Look, the Luxons win by killing everything and everyone in their path. It's what they have to. The Kurzicks have to utilise a little more strategy -- they have to conquer mines, run amber and protect Gunther. If they stop doing the first two, they'll have an incredibly hard time doing the latter. I've been in matches where I was the only one running amber and bringing the green gate back up three or four times in a row (we still lost those matches, because, well, one person can't do it all).

I think I should also note that the number of players on the Kurzick side is declining because of all the leechers. The Luxons sometimes even have two districts when there's about a dozen people on the Kurzick side. I know there are times of the day where I just don't want to enter because I see Leechers X, Y and Z in the lobby and I don't want to get stuck with them. It's already hard to win for the Kurzicks and having two or more leechers simply makes it impossible and also a lot less fun.

Servant of Kali
21-07-2006, 09:35
About Rit Lords in RA - I continue to be impressed with just how much you can contribute to a Kurzick victory as a Rit Lord spamming protection. I have found that with just ONE keeping one side safe (very slow to get through), and THREE people devoted to running amber, you have very good odds of victory.

Yea that's how i win on Kurzick side. RLord and spam it. Sure they get in, but they do get in very slow AND sometimes not at all. Believe it or not, if there is only turtle and like 2 luxons, they wont get in. If there's a whole group then sure u cant hold it, but even then they'll get in much slower.


interrupt siege turtle attacks / kill siege turtle (to be honest I am shocked at how many rangers arrive at FA and tell me they are not capable of a single interrupt)

lmao i know! but it's so fun when i play luxon... im spamming dmg rituals (5 sec cast each!) in front of rangers nose and laugh at them. I mean, ranger without a single interrupt (unless touch one) is sooo noobish! In general, and especially on this map, kurzick side.


I don't find spamming shelter/union/displacement especially thrilling..

I guess im one of the rare who dont find it boring :) I like it. But it's probably because i use different Rt builds all the time, it's not like i play the same one over n over again.


Since I switched to ritual lord in FA I find that I win roughly half my games. Before when I came as channeling I won I'd say about 10% of the time. Coincidence?

It's what i've been saying. On Luxon side a lot of things work, but Kurzick side is more specific. Some builds work far far more than others. A 40% difference which you mentioned isnt luck, it's how i manage to win most games when im on kurzick side, or even have winning streaks. You will win more than 50% if you ragequit when you have leecher, and ragequit when you see warriors and others standing inside the fort doing nothing and waiting for luxons to come in. If you're lucky to have 1 monk (or another RLord), it's almost guaranteed win. The only thing i ont like are monks who run tru portal, go outside, die there. By the time they are spawned enemy breaks through the gate. I mean.. pls, if ur monk, which is great, at least try to benefit the team more than average WMo.


Bonder monks are your best friend on the Kurzick side. I synced my entrance with two bonder monks a few times last night

lol i used to sync one night with bond monk too (but i was RLord)... we had a winning streak (never lost) but it was really late and i had to go to sleep :) That's why im saying 1 single player can make a huge difference on kurzick side. 2 can be invincible :)


Then the Kurzicks play like a Luxon, i.e. they go on a mad killing spree and stop running amber. And then we lose.

That's so true, and it's one of the main reasons why playing as Kurzick is difficult. People just aint used to playing map defensively. But it's no different on Luxon side. Instead of killing NPCs, following turtle.. they keep wasting minutes and minutes killing stance tanks and alike, over and over again. Yes when you're luxon, along with turtle you can sweep off everyone off the path, but even then it's not good to waste time fighting tanks.


I know there are times of the day where I just don't want to enter because I see Leechers X, Y and Z in the lobby and I don't want to get stuck with them.

Yea.. most of them are there whole day. I see some on Luxon side as well, but since there are more luxons chance of getting leecher is slightly less. Kurzick side is horrible, i simply dont play it. Actually, as i said in the other thread, jadeite and amber prices dropped a lot, and along with leechers i have no intention to play Aspenwood for the time being. It's sad because the map is fun, but leechers make it unplayable.

Raven Flameheart
21-07-2006, 10:53
That's a pretty good guide. I often find very few players who actually understand how to play right, and often the turtles aren't targetted nearly enough. I also agree on the balancing issues - not only in terms of Faction per time, but I've found even with a strong, organised Kurzick side, a poor Luxon side can sometimes win (I've experienced this from both sides of the fence, often resulting in "How on earth did we win that?").

A few skills I find useful, in particular against the turtles:
-Grenth's Balance (bypasses turtle armour, takes advantage of the turtle's high max health)
-Disrupting Shot (interupts and lengthens recharge on the turtle's main attack strength)
-Searing Heat (in particular if you're also packing a Water snare, the Burning effect gets through the turtles armour, and the AoE scatter can mess up the Luxon Warriors' offense)

In addition, the "balcony" overlooking the gap between the inner and outer gates is a great spot for rangers to stand.

Djinn Effer
21-07-2006, 13:50
Not to be mean or anything.. But is this actually considered PvP? :huh:

Servant of Kali
21-07-2006, 14:01
It's pvpve... so yea it's considered pvp more than pve. Not to be mean, but what do you consider it as? If you consider it as pve, how come i can kill another player in this mission? If you consider it pve, how come this is the only pve mission where you cant make a group?

Djinn Effer
21-07-2006, 14:23
It's pvpve... so yea it's considered pvp more than pve. Not to be mean, but what do you consider it as? If you consider it as pve, how come i can kill another player in this mission? If you consider it pve, how come this is the only pve mission where you cant make a group?

Honestly, I only know where the places are and that they are in PvE. I know that they are something like Alliance Battles but I've heard they have NPCs as well? I'm also unsure of what the reward is, I should probably actually do one to see... Infact, I think I will - right now.

Servant of Kali
21-07-2006, 16:09
That's why i said it's pvpve, but it's more pvp than pve. It's for pve-only characters, yes. The focus is more on NPCs, yes. But player killing is there, and it's not NPCs itself who do everything but teams behind them. In short, you should simply try it :)

Ashin
21-07-2006, 17:12
The only thing i ont like are monks who run tru portal, go outside, die there. By the time they are spawned enemy breaks through the gate. I mean.. pls, if ur monk, which is great, at least try to benefit the team more than average WMo.

Well Kurzick side I think WMo can benefit the team because they can basically tank a turtle and four luxon warriors without taking much damge or needing much maintenance, while other players kill them. I think their virtue is in keeping luxon warriors busy, who cannot really hurt a good WMo much at all.

As for monks, last night we had three in the group. I stated "I will protect purple side who will take orange?" The replies were:

"I smite."
"I'll help with purple."
"I'm going to follow people around and heal them."

???

Seriously guys..

Smite monk in FA? You better be a really good amber runner or siege turtle killer, otherwise I'm not interested.

Help me on same side? No. A good rit lord does not need help. He needs amber. Three people running amber and I guarantee I can make my side so slow to breach that they will never see the green gate, as long as three people are running amber and never stop.

Follow people around and heal them? Negative. I realize such person is trying to be generous and helpful. They are not. You know what the consequence of a player dying is? They instantly respawn with full health and full energy. ITS NOT A BIG DEAL. Consequence of an NPC dying? They are permanently dead until amber replenishes their post, and potentially the enemy has a fast/free path into your fort now.


Yes its a PvP map but honestly, its just barely PvP. Especially for Kurzick all of your primary objectives are PvE in nature. Kill/interrupt siege turtles, run amber, protect NPC's. Of course you will have scuffles with players but that isn't the focus of the match. Its just a fun distraction.

My formula right now is basically you need four people who really understand what they are doing and you are likely to win. Need at least one amber runner, one npc protector, and the other two can do either of these two things. Those four people will win the match for you. If you have interrupt rangers on siege turtles, or other folks that are killing siege turtles, that's helpful. But honestly if you have four players covering amber running and npc protection, you can win even if you did not kill a single siege turtle.

Siege turtle hits me for 35 damage when I am doing my job, just to put it in perspective. It hit a warrior for 0 damage with my spirits up. So honestly.. protect npcs, run amber. If you come to FA, why not increase your odds of victory by being one of these key four people that will win the match.

Djinn Effer
21-07-2006, 17:48
Ah well, I tried it.. Lost the first cause I had absolutely no idea wtf was going on.. not sure anyone else did either. After that, I watched the cinematic and so far I'm 6-0 after that. *shrug* I still don't know if you should take the amber to the gate people or gunther, I always take it to gunther but it seems like it would help if you took it to the guards too.. *shrug*

Ashin
21-07-2006, 18:16
ALWAYS give it to gatekeepers first. It is a vital mechanic of this game that you constantly restock your npcs and repair your gates.

IF, and only if, all gates are fully repaired, and you have some surplus that the gatekeepers will not take (which does happen if you have three dedicated amber runners), then you can give it to gunther, which will speed up your progress bar. The primary purpose of amber is to repair gates and replenish npcs. Giving it to Gunther is only something you do when you're so far ahead and have so much amber that you really don't know what else to do with it.

Kali- this question reminds me of a common error that beginners make, which you might want to clarify in your base post for them.

A lot of beginners seem to think that if you want to repair the orange gate, you need to bring "orange" amber from the orange mine. And if you want to repair the purple gate, you need purple mine. That is completely false.

You can have either mine; it does not matter.

What determines which gate is repaired is which NPC you give it to. They are labled for you. One gatekeeper says (orange) and the other says (purple). So you choose, when you turn the amber in, which gate to repair. If the green gate is down, either one of these guys will repair it. If you are not sure which gate you should repair, just ask in team. Better to ask than waste one, although if nobody answers you right away just give to whomever.

However! Please note that they will not accept amber from you while under attack. So, typically if you let your green gate get broken, you will lose the game shortly afterwards because it will be very difficult to complete any repairs at all, even if you keep the gatekeepers alive.

Also remember that you do not need someone "guarding" a mine. This is a total waste of a person. Have your squad of three runners sack the mine, grab three ambers, and run them back. If the luxon take back the mine, meh.. it doesn't matter all too much. Either run back and re-take it, or go to the other side. You should always follow the path of least resistance. Don't try to be a hero by sieging a mine guarded by 5 players. Typically if the luxons are at one mine, they are not at the other.

Servant of Kali
21-07-2006, 21:10
Kali- this question reminds me of a common error that beginners make, which you might want to clarify in your base post for them.

I thought it's self evident.. but then again i cant edit the post anymore, it's too old.

Amadei
22-07-2006, 08:26
and ragequit when you see warriors and others standing inside the fort doing nothing and waiting for luxons to come in.

It always makes me go ._. when I see a warrior just uselessly standing around waiting for the Luxons to come to him. For the sake of cute, fluffy bunnies, do something! Go out there! Be a nuisance, go get a mine, stall a group of Luxons outside, harass the minion master or monk, something, ANYTHING. When I play a mesmer or air ele, I often make suicide runs on a mine -- I'll die taking it, but at least the Luxons will have to spend another minute getting it back while I respawn inside and take care of some warriors there.


That's so true, and it's one of the main reasons why playing as Kurzick is difficult.

Yup. The biggest mistake the Kurzicks make (over and over and over again :rolleyes: ) is thinking this is PvP. It's not, not entirely. As a Kurzick, I kill many more NPCs than actual players -- the Luxon longbows at the mines being the prime example -- and I run amber like my life depends on it.


and along with leechers i have no intention to play Aspenwood for the time being. It's sad because the map is fun, but leechers make it unplayable.

:( It makes me sad to hear that, but I completely understand how you feel. It's just no fun finally getting into a match and seeing those familiar names on your party window. I don't like leaving, but I will leave now and re-enter; that way, I'll get a new group and the leechers are stuck in the old match waiting for the Luxons to kill Gunther.


Smite monk in FA?

I've never seen a smite monk in FA that posed any kind of serious threat. Also hilariously easy to kill. All builds are not created equal, and if you play a healer/protector/bonder, at least you'll be more useful.


You know what the consequence of a player dying is? They instantly respawn with full health and full energy. ITS NOT A BIG DEAL.

I've had people yell at me because I didn't heal them. Um, guys, I'm trying to keep that there ele alive so the gate doesn't fall. Yeah, dying sucks, especially if you're running amber, but I prioritize the NPCs over you. Deal.


always take it to gunther but it seems like it would help if you took it to the guards too.. *shrug*

Take it to the gatekeepers if a gate is down (Radik = Orange, Poletski = Purple. They'll fix gates, starting with the inner gate), otherwise, it can go to Gunther. Though I sometimes will wait with amber near a gatekeeper if I think a gate will go down in the next twenty seconds or so, and I will ALWAYS wait with amber next to a gatekeeper if there's only one green gate guard alive (the green gate is guarded by two mesmers, an ele and the Juggernaut). Getting the green gate back up as soon as it goes down buys you another couple of minutes.


Please note that they will not accept amber from you while under attack.

I'm not sure if this is intended behavior, but it is terribly annoying at times. One time, neither gatekeeper would take amber because a frikkin' PET was still in the room. Its owner had died and not yet respawned.

Last night, I finally went out and capped Life Barrier on my monk so I could give bonding a whirl. It's an exceptionally strong build (except against eeeeevil necros :P) that will increase the Kurzick chances at winning dramatically. It was also a lot of fun and the abuse hurled at me and my fellow guildie bonder in local was an extra bonus :D

Gnave
22-07-2006, 13:12
This is why you need to play Jade Quarry.
:O

Servant of Kali
22-07-2006, 14:40
Jade Quarry? U mean, a place where even more leechers would be if it's popular as FA. Besides as i said before JQ is similiar to AB and from what others say, Kurzicks have too much of advantage. In FA they dont, if u know how to play. But the main reason is as stated = boredom. Sorry but, i dont feel like playing maps which are boring to me.

Servant of Kali
22-07-2006, 20:13
Ok i tried Kurzicks 3x today.


Game #1
I see leecher who has been leaching for 2 months by now.
*rage quit*

Game #2
Ranger in my team starts casting EoE, NR and other spirits as soon as he loaded, around Gunther.
*rage quit*

Game #3
Kurzick Player One keeps spamming the team chat.. calls each target 20x and keeps repeating it. Whatever he does he just spams it all over.
Me: "Stop spamming or i'll rage quit. Damn kids, grow up!"
Kurzick Player Two: "You grow up"
Me: *rage quit*



..ok so... is it just me or the general audience in FA is way below average? Some people should be caged. Yes i pvp elsewhere, but nowhere, even in Random Arena is the situation so horrible. I hear pve players complaining all the time how they dont like pvping because people have bad manners there. And now, Anet gives a pvp arena exclusively to pve players... what do i see? Worse behavior than in any pvp Arena, to the point when it's unplayable. I used to get frustrated a lot in RA for instace. But even there it didnt seem so out of hand as here. You may say that this has nothing to do with pve players but oh it does. Why do normal pvp players on avg seem to have more good manners than avg pve player in pvp? Why do average pvp players seem to take advices and improve their gameplay (otherwise they wouldnt be avg players but sucky ones) and pve players have "dont tell me how to play the game" attitude and remain to suck? Maybe im just too old for this and need to start playing games (if at all) where credit card is needed. That would eliminate at least 90% of immature teens.

Djinn Effer
23-07-2006, 00:39
..ok so... is it just me or the general audience in FA is way below average? Some people should be caged. Yes i pvp elsewhere, but nowhere, even in Random Arena is the situation so horrible. I hear pve players complaining all the time how they dont like pvping because people have bad manners there. And now, Anet gives a pvp arena exclusively to pve players... what do i see? Worse behavior than in any pvp Arena, to the point when it's unplayable. I used to get frustrated a lot in RA for instace. But even there it didnt seem so out of hand as here. You may say that this has nothing to do with pve players but oh it does. Why do normal pvp players on avg seem to have more good manners than avg pve player in pvp? Why do average pvp players seem to take advices and improve their gameplay (otherwise they wouldnt be avg players but sucky ones) and pve players have "dont tell me how to play the game" attitude and remain to suck? Maybe im just too old for this and need to start playing games (if at all) where credit card is needed. That would eliminate at least 90% of immature teens.

Well, its my firm belief that PvErs generally stick to PvE because of the attitude "don't tell me how to play the game." So basicly, what I think it boils down to is they want their 15k specific armors and are going in these places hoping to get the faction for it, they still have the same attitude however but since this is actually something like PvP this is where the problem occurs.

By the way, I've heard a lot of people complain about rage quiting lately... Don't you think you do rage a bit much?

Servant of Kali
23-07-2006, 00:48
By the way, I've heard a lot of people complain about rage quiting lately... Don't you think you do rage a bit much?

A what? You dare to doubt my judgements!?! *RAGE QUIT*






:P


ps: It is true, however, that i discovered rage quitting as a great and funny way to battle frustration which is caused by one or more team members. There's just something awesome about *rage quit* :) For instance, i get in a team for Abbadon's Mouth mission. Then after a bit of chat ranger says he can heal too... I tell him to just go dmg and not bother with healing, and he says "I'll play what i want to play". lol so i told him "when someone says that, it creeps me out....." And i rage quit! Oh man did i rage quit!..and left the team (mission didnt start yet anyway, but i'd quit in mission too prolly). Sorry, if it was caster saying he can heal somewhat... fine, but warrior or ranger with less regen bothering with heals.. umm no. Just... no. Especially when we have 2 monks already in a group (well, 1 Mo 1 Rt).

Ashin
23-07-2006, 09:04
I was shocked at the difference in PvP skill level between RA and FA. Mind you, I'm of the opinion that most people who attend RA are quite poor at PvP. But there are also a few quite good ones.. REALLY good sometimes.

Fort Aspenwood is cesspool. Great map too.. shame.

Servant of Kali
24-07-2006, 01:14
Tried today.

Game1: on Kurzick side: Victory.
Game2: a ranger in our own team put eoe down at the beginning... monk left, i left
Game3: 1 minute till the end of the battle, then Gunther died. Why? Because for 5+ minutes i was trying to explain to people that they should run amber instead of pvping. Well... it didnt work. Not a single one ran a single amber...yes... for 5+ minutes.

Game 4,5,6: I join in, call for attention, say "Running amber = win, killing Luxons = loss." And i rage quit. Yes that's right, i rage quit 3x after giving em educational lesson.


Very ... unproductive day for me... sigh. I failed Frost Gate bonus because team didnt understand the line drawings on the minimal which meant STOP DONT GO THAT WAY.. and those instructions in team chat which went like "dont go that way i'll take care of it, u clear the path, i'll get the dwarf"... but noooooo i get reply "i like to kill".. so they go to kill, pick the dwarf, then go to follow bonus path... what happens.. oh wait, dwarf easily dies at first enemy mob. Great. Wooohoo. The worse thing is that i could complete mission and bonus alone, but i preferred company so i join PUG team. Optimism fails once again and human factor proves to be a huge obstacle.

Is there intelligent life in the universe?

Striken7
24-07-2006, 03:14
Just to add a little something myself, I don't think people appreciate how very, very useful a good stance tank can be. Run out there and just stand in front of the turtle. I've seen 55 Monks do this as well. You don't need to kill it, just make it shoot at you, and stay there as long as you possibly can. If you can keep the turtles away from the gates in the first place, you've pretty much become just as useful as a Bonder.

Yakumo
15-08-2006, 14:53
ALWAYS give it to gatekeepers first. It is a vital mechanic of this game that you constantly restock your npcs and repair your gates.

IF, and only if, all gates are fully repaired, and you have some surplus that the gatekeepers will not take (which does happen if you have three dedicated amber runners), then you can give it to gunther, which will speed up your progress bar. The primary purpose of amber is to repair gates and replenish npcs. Giving it to Gunther is only something you do when you're so far ahead and have so much amber that you really don't know what else to do with it.

It amazes me when I see people who either don't know or don't fully understand the importance of this. I've been in situations when it's still quite early in the battle, and yet they will give the amber to Gunther rather than repair the gates. Shifting the progress bar alittle when two or more gates are down doesn't help much.


If you are not sure which gate you should repair, just ask in team. Better to ask than waste one, although if nobody answers you right away just give to whomever.

What I tend to do, if I missed the update of which gate is down, is give the amber to the gatekeeper opposite to the side I just came in on (unless I had to run through a horde of Luxons). If he doesn't accept it, then I give it to the other.

I mean, if I came in on orange then I would have a good idea of how much of a threat there is. If it was a clear run, then I would know that as the mine is ours, all the Luxons are on purple side (and are being rez'ed there). So fixing purple will be more of a priority to slow their attacks.

Azrael STX
15-08-2006, 16:10
While it ture EoE CAN be used to stall it kills your npcs as well as the enemies and that is bad mojo. I dont know how many times Ive seen a Kurzick ranger use this spirit INSIDE the Green Gate after a breach.
This is intentional. When I was a new Luxon with all my turtalistic pride, I used to join Kurzick side and do the same thing. They aren't newb, they're Luxon.


Its very difficult for a kurzick team to win against a team with both a disenchanter and EoE. Though those times are far and few between, the chance for it to even happen has made me stop visiting aspenwood.
I always join Luxon as R/N with EoE, Rend Enchantments, and Well of the Profance, among other things. Assuming I have a decent team, we always win. What's the point of playing on Kurzick side, really? Amber sells for 50% more, but you can make faction 100-200% faster on Luxon side, getting you net profit.

I was playing on Kurzick a lot more recently, but after a while, the general incompetence of my teammates became overwhelming. You can call EoE all day and no one will help you kill it. Then, 20 seconds later when everyone's dead, you respawn in the outpost, and the nearby warrior who was ignoring you says on public chat "Wtf??"

Wtf indeed.

The last time I won on Kurzick, it was because I brought my A/Rt and had Spirit Walk and Consume Soul. Sad I had to waste an elite slot because no one understands the concept of a called target.

*Important* If you want a real tip to win on Kurzick side, here's one from a veteran Luxon: Bring Cry of Frustration. It doesn't matter if you have to change your secondary to Mesmer and buy the skill, and put absolutely no points into the attribute. The fact is, it interrupts EoE and casts through walls, no LoS required. With that single skill, all you have to do is keep the guy using EoE targetted. Everytime you see him trying to put down EoE, interrupt it. Its 60 second recharge will frustrate him to no end.

As they say, an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. I can't tell you how many times my team has lost because one Kurzick ?/Me brought that single skill.

Amadei
15-08-2006, 17:51
I always join Luxon as R/N with EoE, Rend Enchantments, and Well of the Profance, among other things. Assuming I have a decent team, we always win. What's the point of playing on Kurzick side, really? Amber sells for 50% more, but you can make faction 100-200% faster on Luxon side, getting you net profit.

You have a good point :/. But I honestly do prefer playing Kurzick and not just because my alliance is Kurzick -- I find the defending a whole lot more challenging and interesting than mindlessly slaying everything in your path.


I was playing on Kurzick a lot more recently, but after a while, the general incompetence of my teammates became overwhelming. You can call EoE all day and no one will help you kill it. Then, 20 seconds later when everyone's dead, you respawn in the outpost, and the nearby warrior who was ignoring you says on public chat "Wtf??"

Oh, God, are you me? Because I swear that's what happens every single time I play. I can scream (and I have :P), I can give gentle warnings ("guys, if no one kills EoE, we'll lose, no matter how tightly I've bonded that ele"), it doesn't matter. I get ignored. On my mesmer, I've been reduced to wanding the stupid thing many times (I play an illusion mesmer, no Unnatural Signet in my build).


*Important* If you want a real tip to win on Kurzick side, here's one from a veteran Luxon: Bring Cry of Frustration.

Agreed. I have Signet of Disruption, but the idea's still good. If they have an EoE ranger, I will keep my eye on that guy at all times. Sucks to be him if he doesn't have Oath Shot or Serpent's Quickness :P

Servant of Kali
15-08-2006, 20:08
What's the point of playing on Kurzick side, really? Amber sells for 50% more, but you can make faction 100-200% faster on Luxon side, getting you net profit.

This is, of course, true. But you're totally missing the point. I have played AB today after a long long time, and the amount of amber you get in AB is 2-3x than Fort Aspenwood. If you're Luxon, and most of the time win around 10min mark, or even less (sometimes i use to win in 5min).. you STILL can get much more jadeite in AB. That being said, let's be honest, people dont play FA for rewards. Rewards are nice, but nowhere near other maps.

The reason why i am among those who stick to Kurzick side as of late, is challenge. Winning as Luxon is more like "ah ok, next one". Winning as Kurzick is "wow!" .. you really do get a sense of accomplishment. Everyone thinks Luxon side is so much easier and Kurzick next to impossible.. that's why i like winning as Kurzick.

When im frustrated with players on one side, i move to the other. I do notice that during certain times of a day it's better to be Luxon, while sometimes you will notice a lot of good players on Kurzick side, which make playing Kurzick quite easy. Yesterday, i was in a group with a bonder who took care of one gate, and i was interrupting the turtle on the other gate.

Honestly speaking, yes, if Luxons have Rend Enchantments and EoE, it is difficult to win for Kurzicks, but possible nevertheless. Im not one of those who scream "it's tough". Rather, i look for improvements. Thats why i made this thread, in hope that higher skill of Kurzick players will overcome the simplicity of Luxon position.


I was playing on Kurzick a lot more recently, but after a while, the general incompetence of my teammates became overwhelming. You can call EoE all day and no one will help you kill it. Then, 20 seconds later when everyone's dead, you respawn in the outpost, and the nearby warrior who was ignoring you says on public chat "Wtf??"

Yes, that's totally true. I do have a solution - stop playing for the time being and come back to Kurzick side when you notice some competent people there (lets say you lose as Luxon, switch fast to Kurzick side).

I must say, last 2 days i have totally different oppinion than you. Maybe due to different login times. I have played quite a lot on Kurzick side, and the quality of players seem to improve. There are still a lot of newbies who come there for the first time, but all i need is one bonder, and it's almost a win. One game yesterday was so boring, that it wasnt even fun. Sure i like to win, but standing idle for 10min... :P

btw, u would still be suprised how many players dont bring EoE (as rangers let's say) or Rend as necros. I can easily play on Luxon side as Rt because Disenchantment is quite merciless against bonders, but i find it boring to play one side all the time, so lately i've been kurzick.


On my mesmer, I've been reduced to wanding the stupid thing many times

Same thing im doing when im Rt ;) sad...
--------------------------------------



Anyhow, after playing as Ranger on Kurzick side, i thought it might be ok to post my build

Savage Shot (endless interruption of turtle, the most important skill)
Dust Trap
Barbed Trap
Snare
Trapper's Focus [E]
Troll's Ungent
Storm Chaser (for amber runs)
Whirling Defense/Dodge/Utility


..basically, the task is quite simple. You're NOT dmg. Dmg doesnt win the game for Kurzick, tactics do. Interrupting the turtle alone does alot, because you also block the turtle from moving on.

Traps are quite simple - mostly cripple. As i run amber, if gates are down i stop for a sec, spam trap, continue running, spam trap, continue running. If Luxons need 5min to arrive to the battlefield due to cripple... cool :)

I am not sure about elite skill. I used Spike trap at first, but i was often getting interrupted a lot because i tend to be in the middle of enemy groups, kiting, interrupting turtle etc. Spike trap meant a lot, but what's d point if i couldnt cast it when needed. Mantra of Resolve is horrible in Aspenwood because if you're wanded by 5 people you're out of energy in a sec.

So far it worked nicely, i have won quite a lot of games last night with it. Any suggestions are welcome, as i dont play trapper a lot. This was more of a brainstorming build.

Servant of Kali
15-08-2006, 20:26
PS!

Awesome news!

The new weekend event features Fort Aspenwood and Jade Quarry! Rejoice people :) I only hate it that pvp characters can access the area. This means we will see incredible amount of gimmick builds. I can already see Luxon teams with 8 touch rangers. No bonder on Kurzick side can counter that, NPCs dont kite either... all in all, seems like i'll be Luxon in this event.

Ashin
16-08-2006, 07:33
I think.. I will attend Jade Quarry so that I can stay Kurzick. I see no hope for the Kurzick's in Fort Aspenwood. But perhaps with the influx of PvP characters, we'll finally see more than one or two matches per day of JQ.. that is.. assuming the Luxons permit this.

Servant of Kali
17-08-2006, 09:46
Yea, i see no hope for Kurzick side in this event either. It's either Luxon Aspenwood or Kurzick JQ. Unless... someone comes with ingenious idea of how the Kurzicks may win equally or more than Luxons during this weekend and after it. Without sync entering the battle, i just dont see it atm.

kburt
17-08-2006, 19:19
This is, of course, true. But you're totally missing the point. I have played AB today after a long long time, and the amount of amber you get in AB is 2-3x than Fort Aspenwood. If you're Luxon, and most of the time win around 10min mark, or even less (sometimes i use to win in 5min).. you STILL can get much more jadeite in AB. That being said, let's be honest, people dont play FA for rewards. Rewards are nice, but nowhere near other maps.

The reason why i am among those who stick to Kurzick side as of late, is challenge. Winning as Luxon is more like "ah ok, next one". Winning as Kurzick is "wow!" .. you really do get a sense of accomplishment. Everyone thinks Luxon side is so much easier and Kurzick next to impossible.. that's why i like winning as Kurzick.

When im frustrated with players on one side, i move to the other. I do notice that during certain times of a day it's better to be Luxon, while sometimes you will notice a lot of good players on Kurzick side, which make playing Kurzick quite easy. Yesterday, i was in a group with a bonder who took care of one gate, and i was interrupting the turtle on the other gate.

Honestly speaking, yes, if Luxons have Rend Enchantments and EoE, it is difficult to win for Kurzicks, but possible nevertheless. Im not one of those who scream "it's tough". Rather, i look for improvements. Thats why i made this thread, in hope that higher skill of Kurzick players will overcome the simplicity of Luxon position.



Yes, that's totally true. I do have a solution - stop playing for the time being and come back to Kurzick side when you notice some competent people there (lets say you lose as Luxon, switch fast to Kurzick side).

I must say, last 2 days i have totally different oppinion than you. Maybe due to different login times. I have played quite a lot on Kurzick side, and the quality of players seem to improve. There are still a lot of newbies who come there for the first time, but all i need is one bonder, and it's almost a win. One game yesterday was so boring, that it wasnt even fun. Sure i like to win, but standing idle for 10min... :P

btw, u would still be suprised how many players dont bring EoE (as rangers let's say) or Rend as necros. I can easily play on Luxon side as Rt because Disenchantment is quite merciless against bonders, but i find it boring to play one side all the time, so lately i've been kurzick.



Same thing im doing when im Rt ;) sad...
--------------------------------------



Anyhow, after playing as Ranger on Kurzick side, i thought it might be ok to post my build

Savage Shot (endless interruption of turtle, the most important skill)
Dust Trap
Barbed Trap
Snare
Trapper's Focus [E]
Troll's Ungent
Storm Chaser (for amber runs)
Whirling Defense/Dodge/Utility


..basically, the task is quite simple. You're NOT dmg. Dmg doesnt win the game for Kurzick, tactics do. Interrupting the turtle alone does alot, because you also block the turtle from moving on.

Traps are quite simple - mostly cripple. As i run amber, if gates are down i stop for a sec, spam trap, continue running, spam trap, continue running. If Luxons need 5min to arrive to the battlefield due to cripple... cool :)

I am not sure about elite skill. I used Spike trap at first, but i was often getting interrupted a lot because i tend to be in the middle of enemy groups, kiting, interrupting turtle etc. Spike trap meant a lot, but what's d point if i couldnt cast it when needed. Mantra of Resolve is horrible in Aspenwood because if you're wanded by 5 people you're out of energy in a sec.

So far it worked nicely, i have won quite a lot of games last night with it. Any suggestions are welcome, as i dont play trapper a lot. This was more of a brainstorming build.

The build I use for FA Kurzick is beastmaster/interupter. I came up with specifically to deal with the turtle/4 warrior combo. Basically, I run amber till one of the turtle groups has entered one of the outter gates. Then I concentrate on the turtle. With just distracting shot and savage shot I can keep the turtle interupted indefinitely. That is until the inner gate is down, and then the 4 warriors will come after me to shut me down from the turtle. But, with the added health I am constantly getting from my pet (once the inner gate is down) attacking the turtle and keeping troll ungent up I can usually out last the warriors before the turtle goes down.
I usually run 376H and 29E using:
Exp=12 (9+1+2) Halves energy needed
BM=14 (11+3) (with call of haste and predatory bond feeds me +29H every 2.5 sec)
MRK=10 (9+1)(my highest bow req.)
WS=9 (8+1) (+7H every sec for 10 sec w/ TU)

Charm Animal
Comfort Animal
Call of Haste
Predatory Bond
Savage Shot
Distracting Shot
Storm Chaser
Troll Ungent

Storm Chaser is purely a boost for running amber. In the beginning I didn't know wether the turtle was using a spell or a skill, so I brought both SS and DS. And, found out by accident that both interupted the turtle offenses. And SS interupts the turtle defenses. With DS only 5E (and recharge time just happens to coincide with the turtles recharge time) I use it to interupt the turtles offense. And, spam SS for the rest. I have kept turtles pretty much useless between the inner and outter gates, and many times even tie up a monk who thinks they need to keep the turtle healed, using this build. If the inner gate comes down the pet does the damage that takes them (monk then turtle) out. If the inner gate doesn't fall, who cares? The clock is still ticking....
BTW, if there are no turtles inside one of the outer gates, I just run amber.
HTH

Azrael STX
20-08-2006, 00:51
http://forums.gwonline.net/showthread.php?t=417273

This is a build I created for Kurzick FA and have been enjoying quite a bit =D Check it out.

EternalSoul
20-08-2006, 03:02
I had a trapper build for a little just because it seemed so useful, and it was.

I just used spiked (E), barbed, dust, flame. Then dodge, storm chaser, whirling, and serpent's quickness.

I found interupting not to be too troublesome as I wouldn't lay traps in a group. What I did was run amber with the two speed stances and would just trap everywhere I possibly could when I wasn't. Like when they get to the last gate, I would just run around the middle area laying traps everywhere with SQ they recharged decently fast, and no one targeted me :grin:

Then if they were close enough to target me I would go inside and just layer the traps on top of each other right at the gate. Seemed to work fine, pushed back a few groups like that.

oh 15 exp 14 wild (no sup wild :cry: )

Forgot to say, Dodge and Storm Chaser at the attributes I had were like an infinite speed boost. Dodge lasted 11 seconds Storm lasted 19, each had a 30 second cooldown.

Nikhera
20-08-2006, 04:36
If you want to rend through assaulting enemy ranks, clear mines, or do something to those turtles, an SS necro is a good choice. :D

Also, I tried running amber as a Mist Form ele. It worked well for awhile. :D Just hope people don't notice you. :p I had an assassin run away from me...repeatedly. Fun ^_^

Dark Green
20-08-2006, 14:14
If you're sick of losing as Kurzick, bring a monk. Especially now since pvp chars can get in. If everyone would only do that, all the Siege Turtles and warriors would not be able to kill Gunther.

BobbyEwing
20-08-2006, 17:56
Just to add a little something myself, I don't think people appreciate how very, very useful a good stance tank can be. Run out there and just stand in front of the turtle. I've seen 55 Monks do this as well. You don't need to kill it, just make it shoot at you, and stay there as long as you possibly can. If you can keep the turtles away from the gates in the first place, you've pretty much become just as useful as a Bonder.

I quickly realised this, and it's a good reason to bring wild blow on any w/ or /w as a Luxon. Lot's of PvE wammos using their regular stance build, and its always hillarious when I see them put on all those stances and then "poof", one wild blow and theyre all gone.

EternalSoul
20-08-2006, 19:37
I saw the mention of no smite monk, well I was bored and ran the Air of Smite prebuild and went to FA. Fun stuff :smiley:

It keeps one or two ppl alive relatively well (not yourself though) and plus with Balth Aura the Luxon Warriors just fall, oh so do the Minions of an MM just watching all these numbers go up from Balth Aura and Zealot's Fire.

Anywho with the Air of Smite prebuild I just find someone who's in a group, whether it be an NPC, a tank, or a caster, anyone who's in a group. Cast Air of Smite then balth aura then just keep spamming RoF Guardian and Air of Smite as fast as I can. They usually end up surviving with a circle of corpses or something close to it.

Oh reminds me, had a long game one time since no one really ran amber...and well they had both turtles on ther, only ther. As well as their entire team both gatekeeprers were . 2 monks and a ritualist on the Kurzick side, we held em off the entire game. Both turtles were on ther at little less than half of when God's Vengeance was done. Oh and Tranquility was getting annoying but no one seemed a mind to attack it despite me calling it all too many times.

I also don't see why ppl say winning on Kurzick is so hard, I probably win 9/10 game on the Kurzick side, with or without leechers. Luxons I tend to win about the same as well. Oh and on the Luxons I like to play a water ele :grin: can't kill too well but seeing the amber runners walking is funny. Especially since I can keep em walking all the way to the gatekeepers/Gunter if need be. Oh yeah, slip windborne speed into the ele build to make the turtles get to the gates faster, plus a fast running turtle looks funny.

Orinn
21-08-2006, 02:05
I play both sides, as a Kurzick I either bring a ritlord to protect the gates, or a ranger to take mines and run amber (Barrage + brutal weapon + vampiric bow = dead minekeepers)

Luxon side, I started a new build tonight. N/Me, maxed out death magic, well of suffering, well of the profane, putrid explosion, and decayed flesh. Massive AoE degen. I'd highly recommend as a kurzick, bring corpse denial, mainly for the Luxon MM's. It doesn't have to be much, but when a good MM gets rolling, he can be a royal pain to stop with all the corpses littering the battlefield. Another thought is to bring Verata's Gaze, although that's a wasted slot if there IS no enemy MM.

ijack
21-08-2006, 08:05
I think I had some luck on the Kuzick side, I've won 90% of my run running my mesmer.

My build is:

Inepitude
epidermic
ether feast
image or remorse
distortion
verata's aura
complicate
ether signet

Several role I take on battle ground with this build.

Initially, run in to the beginning position of luxon's, turn on distortion, target, turtle, interrupt the siege, run past and behind them, lure any npc or foolish human player to the back so to buy time for your team to run amber.

after you die, go to the other wave of the luxon's force, by this time they'd be at the gate, you'd be behind them. You have 2 choice at this moment and that's something you do at the remainer of the battle:

1) Solo capture mine:
If the luxon do not notice, run to the bowsman, cast inepitute, distortion, epidermic, IR (on the same target) by this time one of them would die. (you'd say long enough to take him down even if there are 3 warrior pounding on you. As long as you finish the sequence, the bowman will die) You can kill the other one if you survive.

You can run amber pass enemy with distortion on you

2) distract the turtle from the back
you just target and wand the turtle, at wand range, you will not aggro the warriors, at this position, the turtle would not move and stay in that position fire siege. Will complicate you can interrupt every other siege and heal yourself with ether feast in between. If there are no human player notice you, you can hold the turtle there the whole match. Since they won't spawn if they dun die, I find this a much much better strategy then kill them or run amber for defence.

Now comes to base defence.

Minons:
Verata's aura is self explanatory, but one more thing to note is even if you die while saccing for verata, minions would become neutral and eventually die under siege.

Kiting Luxon's warriors:
distortion -> inepitute -> epidermic -> distortion......

If you happen to aggro them, this can distract them long enough and help the other 7 player of your team.


BTW, FA is much more fun then JQ.

EternalSoul
23-08-2006, 21:52
Heh Luxon MMs were kinda cool if I there was a warrior on the Kurzick side that trusted me..

With the Air of Smite build Balth Aura...lotsa damage, no running from AoE, minions :shocked: Plus I had Zealot's thingy on and was spamming guardian RoF and Air of Enchantment as fast as I could. See a lotta numbers going up above their heads.

No more Air of Smite pre-build in FA though :cry: oh well I'll just have to get my monk there and play around...or someone else.

Cirian
24-08-2006, 17:54
Why can't you take your Air of Smite anymore? PvP characters have permanent access now :cool:

I played FA for the first time yesterday on my resoration Rt and had a blast, albeit I was playing the Luxon side as that's the PvE side I'm doing at the moment. I lost 3 or more rounds out the many many rounds that I played - maybe a 25% loss / 75% win ratio to Luxons, and it does indeed take Kurzicks a long time to pull that win. I'll definately try the Kurzick's side when I do that side's PvE missions.

A common factor to losing as a Luxon was seeing a bonder on Gunther and amber runners for sure. People were attacking the turtles and there were some very heavy degen N/Me and Me/N characters, but they were very weak to my Resilient Weapon and Wielder's Boon, which out-healed them effortlessly. The interruptors were doing a great job of holding the turtles up though as long as they stayed out of the way.

My elite was Consume Soul, only because I don't have many elites, but that turned out to be catastrophic against enemy spirits - I'm not sure if I can recommend it to Kurzicks if you need Ritual Lord, but Spirit Walk + Consume Soul on a Rt/A deals pretty big aoe heals and can take out an enemy EoE or NR - I was using Consume Soul to take the mines from the cleansers, and it's basically a cake walk.

The oddest thing that happened was having a Kurzick axe/mending wammo clinging feverishly to my ankle like a rabid poodle for a couple of minutes... Eventually I realised he didn't have a hope in hell of killing me and I wanded him down with a little help from Vengeful Weapon and Shadowsong :rolleyes:

I'm definately going back for more tonight ;)

EternalSoul
25-08-2006, 00:26
Oh I didn't know that, gonna haft repre-build the Air of Smite then :grin:

I haven't been on lately due to school and playing on satellite as a monk is impossibile, no ifs ands or buts to it...

So yeah this weekend I'll check FA out again.

Cirian
01-09-2006, 14:39
Well I tried Kurzick at last to finish Befriend the Kurzicks, and I quite like a critical barrage A/R build for taking mines and dispatching enemy turtles and minion masters :cool: Dark Escape + Storm Chaser is good for running amber too.

The other build I like is a warrior with "Charge!" and Sprint for running amber and helping team mates run amber at the same time

Sitting Sock
21-10-2006, 15:04
I only wanted to say: Kali, I loved your guide, but strongly dislike your attitude in the following replies ;)

I go to FA because I find it less repetive than other pvp maps. More to do and more differing situations to deal with. I play kurzik, but have done enough 5min runs on Luxons just go gain access to their exclusive mission.

The main problem for the kurzik side is less people playing it, which in term increases the leechers to active players -rate. Experienced players who want to farm go luxon and new players are discouraged from it because of leechers AND ragequitters. True, ragers are a product of the leechers, but they both hurt our side equally. I can deal with the leechers because they're nothing but an empty seat at a computer and, while admittably rare, I've had the fortune of been in winning games with 3 afk leechers. They're just another constant to factor in, one who's there to make the odds even worse. Ragequitters on the other hand are actively sabotaging and hurting their own cause; In short term they might get a fresh and better game, but in long term they've helped more players find the kurzik side dysfunctional leaving for the luxon.

Oh, and the same about your PvE view :P PuGs are about overcoming teamplay challenges. Beating the mission is secondary. Anyone can beat a mission in GW, but can you beat it as a group without forcing elitists standards on Casual Joe who wants to run his own backwards build? To those like me that's the true heart and soul of GW PvE.

Just food for thought. Thumbs up on a great guide :)

Servant of Kali
22-10-2006, 01:54
Anyone can beat a mission in GW, but can you beat it as a group without forcing elitists standards on Casual Joe who wants to run his own backwards build? To those like me that's the true heart and soul of GW PvE.

Well i have always agreed on that, and always encouraged creativity in both PvE and PvP. However - even though i do encourage all kind of fun builds (after all this is a game, fun is #1 element) - i dont like "backwards" builds :)

That is, i dont mind if a group of friends goes with a handicap build for challenge and/or fun; such as 8 W/Mo paladin builds (Mending, sword etc). But i do mind if someone is running Mending and then explaining to me how awesome it is etc etc. Yes i know you'll disagree :)


Anyhow, wow, havent played FA for a looong time. I gave up on it. From what u just said it looks like there are still a lot of leechers there, so the map is still unplayable and just causes frustration.. not worth it. I think the map is great, and as you said, less repetitive. It was one of my favorite pvp maps but leechers really killed my desire to play on it.

soulstryke
13-11-2006, 14:57
I've read a lot of people using fire eles; but I've found that a couple minor variations on the old stock water ele is perfect for killing Kurzick NPCs - Ice Spikes to keep them from escaping and Maelstrom so they kill themselves when they cast... it's delicious.


Nice guide, has some great points espically this:

"EoE is your biggest enemy."

While it ture EoE CAN be used to stall it kills your npcs as well as the enemies and that is bad mojo. I dont know how many times Ive seen a Kurzick ranger use this spirit INSIDE the Green Gate after a breach.

An intereting killer luxon tactic Ive seen is a luxon streaks in casts EoE as close to the green gate as possible followed by and MM and a couple of tanks. In the resulting battle alot of stuff is leveled and the green gate generally falls. They then streak in to Gunther and repeat.

For Elementalists it is my primary build. Fire and Airis is were the money is in Aspenwood. Not that you cant have a good water or earth build you can. Fire is prefect for clearing gates and mines and some with burning you get a nice degen. I dont know how man times I destroyed mine guards with an Arcane Echo + Firestorm. Air is amazing not simply because of the spike potential but becuase many of its spells dont require LoS. Monk bonding a gate? Cant see him but can reach him with spells well Lighting Hammer, Lighting Strike and the like can.

"Ranger. Interrupts for turtle. Run skills for amber (or both of course). Touch rangers are great. I see a lot of rangers standing on the outer wall, shooting with longbow. I guess it works, but take the right skills."

I would be one. I use a Flatbow for the higher arch, it allows me to clear some structures that many block a shot. About Touch Rangers, I dont like the only because they seem to be a dime a dozen now, they have a serious advantage on the Luxon side. Becuase the gate guards, mine guards, gatebuilders and guther are all staticit is really easy to long on and kill them.

Berserk Vengance
20-02-2010, 10:19
i got one:
ELEMENTALIST
when you are a kurzick elementalist a ood method is to use area spells behind the wall. you kill your enimies fast