View Full Version : I have had it, A- net didnt balance the dervish fully
Evalescore
23-09-2006, 16:55
Yes, finally one of these threads, they are the same nonsense from the last event, they just dont use Cop. Please tell me your opinions on why they are and are not balanced, no derv fanboys allowed
Azrael STX
23-09-2006, 17:13
I think they're balanced, it's just that no one's gotten used to them yet. People said assassins were overpowered, now they say they're underpowered, and they never got a nerf at all. It's just a matter of time before people start adapting to be able to counter the dervish.
Chemical Ali
23-09-2006, 17:20
Azrael is right. I assume that A-Net is pushing for an enchant heavy metagame this time around and just look at how much new enchant removal and spells with enchant in their text there are, corrupt enchant looks awsome.
Even so...
Please note that all Nightfall content and features are being presented in beta form, and are subject to change and improvement before the final release.
Cruel Angel
23-09-2006, 23:24
I'm glad I'm not the only one pointing out that nothing is set in stone yet.
Yes, finally one of these threads, they are the same nonsense from the last event, they just dont use Cop. Please tell me your opinions on why they are and are not balanced, no derv fanboys allowed
And yet you haven't given a reason on why they are unbalanced. Except to say they are the same as during the PvP event... which isn't correct. Mysticism is not the same as it was then, and if my memory is correct alot of the damage on the PBAoE enchants are down as well.
On top of that, anyone who actually likes the Dervish must be a "fanboy" and aren't allowed to discuss something in the Dervish forums? How about no Dervish-haters allowed?
Valerria
24-09-2006, 00:25
Most of the damaging enchants have 20s recharge now, making spamming them one after another much harder.
critical vengeance
24-09-2006, 01:04
yeah not to mention almost every new skills it seems does extra damage to things with enchants... espcially the new assassin skills.
Although at level 2-5 and such i must they cannot live as well as other professions that level.
Akirai Annuvil
24-09-2006, 01:07
And their adjacent. Most of them got triple nerfed, damage, recharge and range; that's not counting the Mysticism nerf. Then it's a quadruple nerf or something :S ?
Anyways I think they've over nerfed them, the enchantments are now almost useless.
Malchiel
24-09-2006, 01:46
They're not overpowered the way they were.
Goldfish God
24-09-2006, 02:21
One of the "new" Elite scythe attacks is actually just one of the old scythe attacks with the Elite restriction.
suikoden
24-09-2006, 02:37
pious renewel is an elite spell now also no more having that AND an avatar skill :cry:
The Last Windseeker
24-09-2006, 06:38
pious renewel is an elite spell now also no more having that AND an avatar skill :cry:
I was dissapointed when i saw that. Durning the pvp even i had that and an avatar and and i had so much energy and health managment, but now the dervish is back to a level where its not overpowered. I'm not exactly sure if its at a normal level or if its really weak compared to other classes now. I would probably say its been over nerfed now but thats only because i played it when it when it could practically take on anythign during the pvp event.
wounding strike also gained elite status..
WhiteHat
25-09-2006, 04:18
I really enjoyed playing a dervish - I think they're quite flexable but not overpowered. having mostly played a N/Me, I just have a very uneasy feeling about damage based on number of enchants active. dispite the fact that they're very easy to re-apply.
I'd like to see how they go against a couple of WoP necros. WoP + Ward against melee = GG dervish. mind you, that assumes you can come up with a corpse for WoP... but isn't that what assassins are for?
on the positive side, the dervish can make it easy for a bonder monk to protect them by covering life bond etc with their own, easy to create enchants.
time will tell I guess
Dreadwing
25-09-2006, 06:39
I think they got way weaker from last event.Their offence hasn't change much a few nerfs like Aoe but still ok.Now the defence department just went down hill I find that they get killed alot faster now compare to last event even with great builds.You could charge in alone in pvp and pve, now u need healing or u die, if ur armour wasn't high enough like in this preview ur dead.Now I guess having heroes to back them up will be ohright bc when they going to fight lvl24+mobs and you can set up builds around you with more enchant etc....
Ju Smurph
25-09-2006, 07:39
BETA WEEKEND.
means things are still going to change... :rolleyes:
So the Beta Preview event hasnt been in play for more than 24 hours and the Dervs are alreayd incredibly over powered to the point that IWAY, Touch Rangers, Bunny Thumpers, Minion Factories, Bonding Monks, Balanced Groups, Skill build thinkers have found no way in which to combat a sing dervish in any groups?
Playing a Derv in the PvE part of the weekend i found them very hard to balance energy without good Energy support skills either on their own bar or their team bar.
Their enchantments are not spammable and easily removable at the wrong time making the X anount of energy + time devoted in to their planning almost pointless Plus the casting times of almost all Derv enchants specially the hard ones - are incredible slow and energy consuming.
Which Build shave been used to combat the Dervs that they have proved so unfailing and infalabile?
Naru
Mr Panda
25-09-2006, 13:14
Yeah, I'd agree with Naru there, mysticsm has been given a big smack with a nerf stick, so enchant bombing is considerably harder. And consider, its hardly impossible to counter either (backfire would hurt like hell...)
The energy issue is a factor, but its more emphasised at lower levels - skills cost the same but the energy gain is crappy.
Zealous anthem spam ftw :p
I think dervish were way nerfed, and are definitely underpowered.... Other classes may be able to utilize certain skills/attributes to enhance the scythe line... However, dervish's scythe skills or rather their damage is quite sad ( save chilling victory, which is a very good skill )... (I have no idea how much weaken lowers damage, but with 15 in scythe and affected by weaken due to wearying strike I only did like 9-21 tops per hit on soft targets)...Hell, I had trouble killing an assassin who uses only shadow refuge I THINK, while spamming chilling victory and wearying strike...
Here's the point... I think dervish deal way too low damage, especially since they have no intterupts or knockdowns... Heck, I'm pretty sure touchrangers can deal more damage over time than a dervish can ( keep in mind I'm counting single targets, because most of the time ppl don't clump together)... To top it off dervish as a melee is very vulnerable to blindness or hexes... And as for the point of mysticism, the only skill I use with it is reversal of fortune in conjunction with Dwayna's form, otherwise I hardly find myself using enchants at all - inotherwords, I just don't use it... Before skills like balthazar's rage really didn't do all that much damage compared to others, but now the recharge is also horrible... overnerfed... <--- the unbalance issues similarly to this, just makes me wonder who's doing the balancing? The result is so way off, it should have been obvious before the change...
halfthought
25-09-2006, 22:23
ermm no, first theres a underpowered, then this, no its not overpowered, for example, no dervishes OWNING hoh, in pve, they got huge damage output, to match, at the very least, a nuker eles damage, but sacrificing personal wellfare to do so, so ide consider them balanced, in amateur level pvp, there not much more powerful then a good warrior
(to the above poster... if your dervish does as much damage as a touch ranger, then you better stop playing a dervish)
Artemis Shadowhawk
25-09-2006, 22:30
I play with several characters in the FPE, and to be honest, I feared a dervish a lot less than a warrior in pvp, and I dont even really fear warriors most of the time. But for the most part, I'd let the dervish just sit and attack me while I just used a little self heal and condition removal. I can't see how anyone can say they are overpowered. And remember, AoE scythe attacks and spells don't do a whole lot in PvP. And that is where most balance issues are concerned.
In NFPE, I didnt see dervish is overpowered.
With their primary, they cant spike, interrupt and KD.
There are no any strengths for them in PvP.
omfgineedaname
26-09-2006, 16:31
Longer cooldown, Worse range, Weaker damage, Worse HP/Energy regen from Mysticism. They're still overpowered? I don't think so.
I played alot of AB with my regular chars. Didn't have that much trouble from the Dervish or Paragons and I didn't have any of the new skills that are there to combat the 2 classes. Yes, they were a bit of a pain but so what. I think when the game is actualy released there will be counters to use. You just have to think about a way to stop em. (Touch Rangers anyone, lol).
Pros
AoE (good for clusterbombs like HA, on paper)
Relatively good autoattack damage
More-or-less spammable deep wound in Wearying Strike
Synergy with smite and other fast-recharging enchants
Cons
Crappy armor, without the assassin's mobility to back it up
No interrupts
No good spiking skills.
Slow attack speed
Whatever changes anet made show: if you go up to an archer in gvg with a dervish, you're going to have a heck of a harder time killing it than with a ranger, a warrior, or an assassin.
killerstick
01-10-2006, 00:29
There's a reason you are allowed a secondary class. Use that to offset your weaknesses. No interupts and you want one? Pick a secondary that has one that would fit your style. Not enough armor? Pick a secondary that provides some defensive skills.
A 100% Derv is underpowered compared to everything with a secondary but that is the same with every class.
negromancer shizzle
01-10-2006, 06:24
A 100% Derv is underpowered compared to everything with a secondary but that is the same with every class.
I feel like the dervish was a perfect noob character, it let you get used to enchantments skills, easy combos. Everyone has their complaints. The dervish is just one of those things that happens to be a very easy char to use.
They felt pretty overpowered in PvE to me still. The shear amount of damage output they can put out with a proper build is pretty insane. There were a few encounters I ran into in the Preview Event that I know normally I had very little chance of beating with most other random teams, but playing as a Dervish I was able to handle the situation because of the combos and damage output.
The Dervish still has a ton of power, and I think it is foolish to discredit them for PvE. As far as PvP goes, I don't have an opinion yet because I don't think a few days of beta is enough time to really evaluate the class in PvP. But I have to say the Dervish brings something else to the table in PvP. Some of you may not consider them a Spike class, and simply a pressure damage class. I beg to differ a bit. If you want to consider them a pressure damage class in PvP then they can do ALOT of pressure damage rather quickly and keep it up. I can see them causing monk's to sweat very easily, because enchantments on a foe won't matter since the Dervish can strip them off very easily so protecting from a Dervish's damage will be a bit more energy intense. So anyway, I would not discredit the Dervish class in PvP either. We still have a ways to go.
And this is all considering a pure Dervish build, when you toss in the secondary class into the mix the power of the Dervish raises significantly.
Artemis Shadowhawk
09-10-2006, 15:37
They felt pretty overpowered in PvE to me still. The shear amount of damage output they can put out with a proper build is pretty insane. There were a few encounters I ran into in the Preview Event that I know normally I had very little chance of beating with most other random teams, but playing as a Dervish I was able to handle the situation because of the combos and damage output.
The Dervish still has a ton of power, and I think it is foolish to discredit them for PvE. As far as PvP goes, I don't have an opinion yet because I don't think a few days of beta is enough time to really evaluate the class in PvP. But I have to say the Dervish brings something else to the table in PvP. Some of you may not consider them a Spike class, and simply a pressure damage class. I beg to differ a bit. If you want to consider them a pressure damage class in PvP then they can do ALOT of pressure damage rather quickly and keep it up. I can see them causing monk's to sweat very easily, because enchantments on a foe won't matter since the Dervish can strip them off very easily so protecting from a Dervish's damage will be a bit more energy intense. So anyway, I would not discredit the Dervish class in PvP either. We still have a ways to go.
And this is all considering a pure Dervish build, when you toss in the secondary class into the mix the power of the Dervish raises significantly.I don't think Dervishes will be able to pressure monks. Not as well as warriors. No knockdowns, no interrupts. I think a monk would be able to sit and heal for the most part, but if things did get tricky, they could just kite. I was really disappointed with the fact that no matter how much damage I dealt, anyone could just kite me around and I couldnt interrupt them.
Maybe that's just me.
NeoCortex
09-10-2006, 15:45
For anybody that thinks Dervishes will be overpowered in PvP, just bring Shadow Shroud with you and you should be able to damn near shut down any Dervish you come across. Since most Dervish skills rely on enchants or stripping of enchants, for the 10 seconds or so that they have Shadow Shroud on, they should be easy tagets. I haven't had a chance to try this, since I didn't PvP much during the last preview, but it seems like it should work really well.
Sable Phoenix
09-10-2006, 16:54
Besides all this, has anyone actually looked at the new skills for Nightfall? Every other class gets tons of skills that specifically affect characters under enchantments. Now, not only will this completely screw over Elementalists even worse than they already are, but it's obvious that the Dervish is being specifically targeted. I don't understand why ANet would make an frontline melee class and then go out of its way to make sure that class gets destroyed in frontline combat. With all the skills specifically designed to kill them, I'll wager anyone 100 platinum that the Dervish could be returned to the level of power it was at during PVP preview event and still not be overpowered. I can almost guarantee it.
We're going to see a repeat of the Assassin here. Just watch.
I don't think Dervishes will be able to pressure monks. Not as well as warriors. No knockdowns, no interrupts. I think a monk would be able to sit and heal for the most part, but if things did get tricky, they could just kite. I was really disappointed with the fact that no matter how much damage I dealt, anyone could just kite me around and I couldnt interrupt them.
Maybe that's just me.
Dervish's come with a few different enchants that will let them apply cripple onto a foe every swing, so even if the monk can cure it, it will be back on. As for interrupts you just take Mesmer as your secondary and there are quite a few very cheap interrupts available that even give energy back to the Dervish. A Dervish/Mesmer seems like a very tough opponent.
For anybody that thinks Dervishes will be overpowered in PvP, just bring Shadow Shroud with you and you should be able to damn near shut down any Dervish you come across. Since most Dervish skills rely on enchants or stripping of enchants, for the 10 seconds or so that they have Shadow Shroud on, they should be easy tagets. I haven't had a chance to try this, since I didn't PvP much during the last preview, but it seems like it should work really well.
It would be difficult to justify spending an elite spot just to handle a single class. Not to mention how easily hex's can be removed.
We're going to see a repeat of the Assassin here. Just watch.
A repeat of the Assassin would require a larger crowd of people bandwagoning onto the Dervish. And frankly I see more naysayers than supporters.
A repeat of the Assassin would require a larger crowd of people bandwagoning onto the Dervish. And frankly I see more naysayers than supporters.
What he meant is the aspect of balancing the class. The assasins were over-nerfed and it was not until 6 months later would Anet pull them back together. It has nothing to do with popularity. In fact, a significant portion of assasin players don't know or care about how balanced the profession was.
PS: How would it work if you are to work a mesmer interrupt skill into a dervish bar? Attribute points aside, the dervish bar has not enough slots as is, you're sacrificing valuable dmg output or self preservation in order to fit that in.
Sable Phoenix
10-10-2006, 02:53
What he meant is the aspect of balancing the class. The assasins were over-nerfed and it was not until 6 months later would Anet pull them back together. It has nothing to do with popularity. In fact, a significant portion of assasin players don't know or care about how balanced the profession was.
Exactly.
Everyone says Dervishes did fine on the starter island. Well, sure. Assassins did too, then as soon as you got off and hit Kaineng they died, and died, and died. The only reason the Assassin enjoys the popularity it does is because everyone wants a ninja. Yet even now, after six months when ANet finally got off their collective butts and gave the Assassin a much needed boost, the stigma of a "paper tank" remains over the entire class. Nobody wants Assassins in a PVE group, and they still die far too quickly for a melee class.
Same thing will happen in Nightfall. Dervishes in the state we saw them at the PVE preview will get slaughtered in the high end game.
GrimShade
10-10-2006, 04:05
Only read this page, but to the OP: what part of Beta preview weekend do you not understand? They are not balanced because that was a beta weekend, and they were testing things out. If you wanted a finished product you shouldn’t have played it, you should have waited till the finished product is out.
As to the Dervish dying…I’ll agree people will die in numbers on the Dervish, but I don’t think it will be a problem with the char. It will be just like the Assassin, people won’t bother learning how to play the character, they will play it like a Warrior and not like a Dervish. This will lead to many deaths and frustration about the class.
If you are still running into dyeing Assassins, credit the player not the class. There are many Assassins out there that are the last to die in the party. A properly played Assassin never get's hit. Whoever thinks it's a Paper Tank is not playing it right. It's a Glass cannon alright but nothing about a tank should be in it's description.
Sable Phoenix
10-10-2006, 16:24
As to the Dervish dying…I’ll agree people will die in numbers on the Dervish, but I don’t think it will be a problem with the char. It will be just like the Assassin, people won’t bother learning how to play the character, they will play it like a Warrior and not like a Dervish. This will lead to many deaths and frustration about the class.
Explain how a Dervish should be played, then?
A Warrior is a physical tank; a Dervish is a magical tank. The Dervish is designed to stay in the middle of as many enemies as possible so that its scythe attacks and damaging enchantments are at their most effective; heck, it can turn into a freaking god, what's more tanklike than that? The difference is that it relies on magical armor rather than physical armor to stay alive. Yet that magical armor is very easy to remove while at the same time damaging the Dervish, whereas nobody can remove physical armor from a Warrior (except temporarily through one Necromancer curse that nobody uses, as opposed to the dozens of enchant stripping skills spread over every other class).
Make no mistake, people will play it the way it looks like it should be played, as a tank. And they'll die, because much of the game is specifically designed to destroy the very thing that makes them able to do their job. Well of the Profane alone will completely incapacitate any Dervish and they'll be dead a few seconds later.
So taking this into account, how, exactly, is a Dervish supposed to be played?
I'm telling you, the Dervish could be returned to the level it was during the PVP preview, and, especially with all the new enchant-killing skills in Nightfall, it wouldn't be overpowered.
Malchiel
10-10-2006, 18:06
Same thing will happen in Nightfall. Dervishes in the state we saw them at the PVE preview will get slaughtered in the high end game.
Can I borrow your crystal ball? I'd like to know who my future wife will be.
GrimShade
10-10-2006, 18:09
Explain how a Dervish should be played, then?
A Warrior is a physical tank; a Dervish is a magical tank. The Dervish is designed to stay in the middle of as many enemies as possible so that its scythe attacks and damaging enchantments are at their most effective; heck, it can turn into a freaking god, what's more tanklike than that? The difference is that it relies on magical armor rather than physical armor to stay alive. Yet that magical armor is very easy to remove while at the same time damaging the Dervish, whereas nobody can remove physical armor from a Warrior (except temporarily through one Necromancer curse that nobody uses, as opposed to the dozens of enchant stripping skills spread over every other class).
...
So taking this into account, how, exactly, is a Dervish supposed to be played?
...
First off it's not out yet so I can't state 100% on how to play it. I can think about how it looks like it should be played and make assumptions, the same as you. And thanks for answering most of the question for me.
The Dervish rely's on his enchants to make tanking viable. Playing a Dervish is going to be enchant management, keep attacking while manageing the enchant stripping that is happeneing and the ones that are expireing. Which enchant is on top will matter as that is the first stripped when enchant stripping comes. You will want to have armor buffing enchants lower on the list and enchants that give life when they end on the top so they get stripped first. When that enchant get's stripped you need to pop it back up before they can get to the next in the list. A maintainable enchant that you can end with the click of a button will be of benefit too.
My predictions are that people will slap on mending and run in and tank, tank, die. The concept of enchant management will be just as forein to people as "don't get into the fight ahead of the tank." If you can't take the class as a different beast and learn to play it as its own thing, you will not be sucessful. We should take bets on how soon a thread will be started stating the Dervish has insufficient armor.
And when you see defile enchant coming...run
NeonKnights
10-10-2006, 18:40
I agree with that assessment.
I can fully picture people that haven't tried it out in either pre-release events to think 'hmm, my scythes attack multiple enemies so I'll be okay", run in blindly, aggro every enemy they can and get themselves beat on by a bunch of enemies that have them surrounded.
I enjoyed what I have seen so far out of this class, and plan to make another as my first character come Nightfall. My only fear is that no-one will want to have one in their group, because of the same reason that people got gun-shy on the Assassin.
I'll reserve the rest of my judgements for the class for when Nightfall actually comes out rather than getting upset about still-beta changes.
Erasculio
10-10-2006, 18:47
The Dervish has strong heals, though. Even ignoring the "more complicated" ones (Mystic Vigor is one of my favourite self heals in the game - it would be completely useless in PvP, but in PvE it's great), there are direct heals such as Natural Healing that have a lot of promise. Between that and the defense skills, I think Dervishes will be easier to play in PvE than Assassins, and so it's less likely we'll see the same reactions.
I do think that Mysticism as a primary attribute is slightly underpowered, since I think the health gained should be higher, but...
Erasculio
The Harlequin
10-10-2006, 20:26
A Warrior is a physical tank; a Dervish is a magical tank. The Dervish is designed to stay in the middle of as many enemies as possible so that its scythe attacks and damaging enchantments are at their most effective; heck, it can turn into a freaking god, what's more tanklike than that? The difference is that it relies on magical armor rather than physical armor to stay alive. Yet that magical armor is very easy to remove while at the same time damaging the Dervish, whereas nobody can remove physical armor from a Warrior (except temporarily through one Necromancer curse that nobody uses, as opposed to the dozens of enchant stripping skills spread over every other class).
Make no mistake, people will play it the way it looks like it should be played, as a tank. And they'll die, because much of the game is specifically designed to destroy the very thing that makes them able to do their job. Well of the Profane alone will completely incapacitate any Dervish and they'll be dead a few seconds later.
This analysis is spot-on. Enchant-stripping spams are quotidian in both PvE and PvP. This is why shouts, stances, preperations, etc. are so popular--they're hard to remove. If you rely on enchants, you better be a backline caster. Every Mes/Nec mob shatters/strips enchants as the first order of business, and with the new skills, so will the greengrocer and shoeshine boy.
GrimShade
10-10-2006, 20:57
I would venture to say PvE mobs will not have the ability to shatter all the enchants a Dervish can have, or be able to keep up. If they shatter an enchant that gives life when it ends, so be it, if they stripp an enchant that causes your damage to be one element over the other, again not hurting your life span. If the enchants are stacked properly then survival won’t be a problem. You just get to play “who has the faster recharge skill”/can you strip them faster than I can keep them up. Then it also makes you re-think your target priority. Take out the enchant killers and your Dervish has an easier time. Derv also has the ability to have the most life which will make the AI not target you in case your enchants can not stay up.
PvP granted good luck keeping the enchants up, at the same time shame on your for bringing many of them. A Nec with Ch1 and Ch2 can bring 2 versions of defile enchants and the more enchants you have the quicker you die. This of getting nailed with 3 defile enchants in a row. (N/Me echo'ed defile enchats/desicrate enchants) And on top of that they weren’t stripped so that enchant that gives life when it ends…didn’t end. In either case you are on a level playing field with the other casters. You will not be like a warrior who is ignored because of ease to shut down and difficulty to kill. You will not be a priority target to be blinded/shut down because of skills like sand shard and other AoE attacks that hit weather you are blind or not, and you will be killable like the other casters. You will have AoE crippling, and enchant stripping, and good speed skills to catch kyters.
Seems fair to me.
Minionman
10-10-2006, 21:35
I doubt enchant removal and other anti-enchant skills will be such a big deal in PvE. In the previous two sampaigns, even though there are large amounts of skills to cause block, evade, slower attack speed, etc., warriors, assasins, and rangers were still able to fight just fine, since monsters with good enti-fighter skills were spread around in the game. For dervishes, this means that even though a lot of anti-enchant skills were added, they still make up a small enough percentage of total skills that the amount of monsters with them will be limited. At most, it seems dervishes will be fighting moderate anti-enchant throughout the game, just enough to keep them on their toes, but not enough to make fighting impossible.
Dervishes have a lot of enchants also, which likely means they'll easily be able to keep the enchants up even with lots of removal.
For PvP, I'm not sur,e however, focusing too heavily on anti-enchant would seem to make them weak to other things, though I don't have enough experience to say.
I don't think enchant removal really hurts a dervish's ability to tank.
Conviction is a stance. Vital Boon.. only 5 energy cast, benifits the dervish when it ends. Armor of sanctity is only 5 energy cast and only a 4 sec cool down and 1/4 sec cast. Mystic Vigor 1/4 cast 5 energy but has a 15 sec cd, so that might hurt.
Mystic Regen and Dwayna's touch are the two abilities that come to mind that hurt with heavy enchant removal.
I don't think enchant removal will neccessarily hurt the dervish much, but not being able to cast enchants.. would hurt a lot.
If enchant removal is used heavily, I will just use a build that removal doesnt hurt.
I ignored the dev in ra...never got killed by one buy the way.
in pvp the boon/prots are pretty much almost gone and so is the need for enchant removal...it won't comeback because of the deverish enchantment heavy build.
The Harlequin
11-10-2006, 15:50
I would venture to say PvE mobs will not have the ability to shatter all the enchants a Dervish can have, or be able to keep up.
Sure they can--on the alpha strike you'll get all the shatter/strip/chillblains and be neekid in your AL 70 glory. The best stategy is to play like the Sin--let the tanks go in first then sneak in on the side. That's what Koss is there for. After that, you're okay--turn on vital boon and then start the enchant spam.
If you are still running into dyeing Assassins, credit the player not the class. There are many Assassins out there that are the last to die in the party. A properly played Assassin never get's hit. Whoever thinks it's a Paper Tank is not playing it right. It's a Glass cannon alright but nothing about a tank should be in it's description.
I'm not an assassin (Necro mostly, also Ele n Monk) but I agree with Grimshade. I will go anywhere with an assassin who knows how to play his character. I can see the same thing with Paragons and Dervish. Learn to play the character and instead of saying " ooohh...melee. must run in and hit..." you play it smart using your abilities to their max and you will be welcome in my party anytime.
Sable Phoenix
11-10-2006, 20:57
I'm not an assassin (Necro mostly, also Ele n Monk) but I agree with Grimshade. I will go anywhere with an assassin who knows how to play his character. I can see the same thing with Paragons and Dervish. Learn to play the character and instead of saying " ooohh...melee. must run in and hit..." you play it smart using your abilities to their max and you will be welcome in my party anytime.
That's great, but it still doesn't mean that the Dervish is not underpowered, just like the Assassin is still arguably underpowered. I've played with several good Elementalist players, I'm one myself, but that doesn't mean that the class itself is not underpowered.
Minionman
12-10-2006, 00:22
I wouldn't say elementalist is underpowered.
As for whether the dervish as meant to tank or not, it always seemed to me that the dervish was designed to hold its own tanking, not as well on average as a warrior could, but good enough to stay in a monster fight and do fine. Some dervish skill combos would than make them very good tanks, some combinations would be more damage, and others would be support of healing, but the average would be somewhere below warrior and better than others.
thehulkuk
12-10-2006, 17:10
but not being able to cast enchants.. would hurt a lot.
;) im hoping so. as my dervish is gonna be set up for this if i use it pvp.
Goldfish God
13-10-2006, 00:23
I made an enchantless dervish during the pvp event. kinda amusing :laugh:
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