toxicity build->degen/pressure [Archive]

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akarias

23-11-2006, 17:33

Hey everyone. One skill which really attracted my attention in NF was toxicity. As did coincidentally the enormous thread on rits. I personally think that with the new weapon spells rits are superior to monks if the monks don't have enchantments. Basically this is a heavily modified version of degen pressure.

2 poisonous RaO thumper r/w

14 bstmaster, 9 exp, 12 hammer
hammer bash, crushing blow, irresistable, RaO, comfort animal, charm animal, Poisonous Bite, res sig

1 cripple ranger r/mo or r/me

15 exp, 9 wild, 12 marks
crippling shot, savage shot, distracting shot, apply poison, whirling defense, draw conditions/inspired hex/penetrating shot/enchant removal (for spike) other utility, troll ungent, res sig

1 bleeding interrupter r*akarias

9 exp, 12 marks, rest in wilderness survival and inspiration
magebane shot, barbed arrows, drain enchantment, inspired hex, revealed hex, whirling defense, res sig

1 spiritspammer

11+1 beastmastery, 9+1+3 expertise, rest in wilderness survival
Oathshot, !TOXICITY!, shadowsong, roaring winds, nature's renewal, whirling defense, troll ungent, res sig

1 flourish assassin a/w

16 dagger mastery, 9 crit strikes, rest in deadly arts
flurry, siphon speed, black lotus strike, horns of the ox, falling spider, twisting fangs, aura of displacement, recall

1 standard air e/mo flagrunner
orb, blinding flash, gale, extinguish, draw conditions, heal party, ether prodigy, storm djinn's haste

1 restoration rit

14 rest 10 spawning 10 channeling
mend body and soul, weapon of warding, vengeful weapon, spirit transfer, spirit light, spirit siphon, wielder's remedy/vital weapon, weapon of remedy [E]

1 WoH monk

Ok, here's the strategy. Heavy pressure with the 2 melee guys, with the rangers spreading conditions. Constant snaring by cripple ranger, and call for melee spike, since there're snares and plenty of enchantment removal. Pretty straightforward, don't overextend or anything, and listen as you play. Rangers interrupt if you can but more important to spread conditions interrupt their heal party spammer-->magebane shot

Spiritspammer is obviously super-key. He provides a lot of the basis for the rit. Nature's renewal kills any hexes which they would have, same with enchantments. In tight places like the lord room, this is key. Toxicity is the main offensive spirit. It allows 5 of the guys have easy -4 degen. The RaO thumpers just have that much more pressure, the cripple ranger suddenly gives -8 degen to everyone, and the flourish assassin hurts the wars that much more. viper's nest around the spirits just for kicks. Roaring winds to counter those annoying paragons (not sure how well this works considering paragon regen), and I suppose you could put in fertile for spike teams. Shadowsong's for the second war which the assassin isn't spiking

Assassin's NOT FRONTLINE. it's BACKLINE SUPPORT. Assassin's job is to spike the war's all the time. With flourish and black lotus strike for energy regen he spikes ALL the time. This is usually enough to severely cripple or kill a war. This does two things. First, obviously it hurts the war and hampers his hurt on the monks. Second, it forces monks to come up, to allow a beating. I know nature's renewal will slow him down...but it's only for 1 more second, so I think it's ok. Help there would be appreciated though-->patccmoi's idea

If they come close enough, assassin can join in the main spike. Recall's for that too

I don't think this build's too dependent on the spirits. First of all they're very renewable and cheap. And even if the ranger dies the rit can still heal decently, just not BETTER than monks without enchantments. The offense is not totally dependent on toxicity at all, it's just supplemented by it.

This build can still split (OMG spirit spammer split). a ranger can run if the other team's playing condition degen as well, for the heal party spam, since the ritualist basically specializes in condition removal, with threevery rechargeable very cheap condition removal (wielder's remedy+vengeful weapon/weapon of remedy, mend body and soul)
ganker: spiritspammer, cripple ranger, rit, RaO
flag: flagger, WoH, melandru's, RaO

Things I'm unsure of: maybe have 2 cripple+poison rangers instead? Does the magebane shot guy fit the build? Maybe have burning arrow instead? And the assassin. Main reason I like him is that he's melee counter without much enchantments or hexes, and that I love assassins lol. But any alternatives? Like a countersmash hammer, or a forceful->fierce->heavy->crushing hammer?

akarias

23-11-2006, 19:06

Oh for the spiritspammer you can also spam tranquility too, by taking out troll or something

Taxed

23-11-2006, 19:56

Hmmm...

The toxicity spirit will quickly become a prime target. Also expect that character to be a major target for interrupts. Spirit spammers are easy to shut down, and teams are bringing interrupts these days. If the spirit does get placed, expect it to live about 5 seconds. The same with your other spirits. Also with RC making a HUGE comeback into GvG, condition pressure is not going to work well unless you can shut that monk down. You have 0 energy denial, and with Paragons and Energizing Finale, that RC monk will have all the energy he needs to happily remove all the conditions, and have monster heals in the process.

You will also most likely get eaten alive by spike based teams. The WoH monk cannot hope to be fast enough to prevent a spike kill. Neither can the rit. This build may have worked before nightfall, but I doubt it can at the present time.

The Thumpers are pretty standard, but with a Paragon spamming Watch Yourself, aren't very effective anymore.

If you do want to run this:
On your cripple Ranger, have you thought about going /d and using the enchantment Harrier's grasp? That would apply cripple to every arrow shot, and free up the elite for something else.
Don't use a WoH monk. I might be tempted to use Holy Haste instead. The faster cast and bigger heals should help a great deal.

EDIT
Another thought...have you thought about removing one of the rangers for a mesmer...Signet of Humility + Mantra of Inscriptions would most likely help a great deal.

akarias

23-11-2006, 22:05

Thanks for the comment. I think if he keeps the spirits fairly far back, and with shadowsong on at all times, they can be kept alive a decent amt before recast, unless they overextend. I have not thought of harrier's grasp, although I'm not liking enchantments unless they're crucial. I'll look into it though. For spike teams the monks can carry infuse, and most pure spike teams need enchantments for support, which the spiritspammer shuts down. Also you can always just split. But yeah I can look into putting infuse into the rit also, since it doesn't need many points to be effective. Again, the spiritspammer isn't key for the entire build. If they're targetting him then they're not shutting down the monks or the thumpers. sig of humility's a good idea though, thanks. Paragons aren't that good v. degen, so if they devote a guy to restricting thumper damage, then the degen should eat through.

cilenia

24-11-2006, 16:28

do you think the rit healer and the woh are enough healing?

nightrunner

24-11-2006, 19:36

Why you would run this over the KGYU version, I'm not sure.

R A N D O M

25-11-2006, 17:15

Maybe i'm missing something:

2 poisonous RaO thumper r/w
1 cripple ranger r/mo or r/me
1 bleeding interrupter r*akarias
1 spiritspammer
1 flourish assassin a/w
1 standard air e/mo flagrunner
1 restoration rit
1 WoH monk

2+1+1+1+1+1+1+1 = 9

slakt

25-11-2006, 20:14

akarias

25-11-2006, 20:40

my bad, take out the bleeding interrupter

R A N D O M

26-11-2006, 07:07

so then you have 1 spammable condition...extinguish ftl

Sertu

30-11-2006, 14:07

u need to protect ur toxicity => take symbiosis as well

akarias

01-12-2006, 00:56

I understand the trapper arguments, but if you watch the iB battles, their trapper doesn't even have monk support and is perfectly fine. He also summons crucial spirits such as nature's renewal and predatory season. This is also against top 30 teams...

Some Dude

03-12-2006, 06:56

Why you would run this over the KGYU version, I'm not sure.

Perhaps you could elaborate on this for us.

Also, your flourish assassin isn't using flourish ^^

R A N D O M

03-12-2006, 08:08

nightrunner

06-12-2006, 01:55

i might have the wrong version of KGYU's build but here's what i think of when i hear kgyu build...

bulls charge sword war
charge sword war
thumper
cripple/poison ranger
melandru's ranger
water ele
2 monks

it's a proven pressure build

That's pretty much it, basically what I meant was using the Cripshot and the Mel's Arrows ranger for spammable conditions. The rest is pretty flexible, Water ele can be swapped for an Air ele, you can put an Axe warrior in instead of one of the sword warriors, ect.