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chirthain
02-01-2008, 12:40
Ok, I was playing AB in the map Grenz Frontier a couple of minutes ago, and I've got a question:

At the beginning of the game, the people who are teleported to the Mesmer Shrine (left side), run after they capped it to the Ressurect Shrine, instead of the warrior one. I don't really get it... The Luxons cap the warrior shrine, and run to the mesmer shrine, and instead of defending it, or kill the luxons and take the warrior shrine, the kurzicks run to the ressurect shrine, while there is already a team capping that one. :huh: (that's the team that walks through the front door at the beginning).

So, can anyone explain this tactic to me?

Purity of the Raven
02-01-2008, 12:59
....Their idiots?

Would of been my first guess.

Silicon Based
02-01-2008, 14:22
It would always be a good idea at least to check whether 2 luxon teams storm the res shrine at game start, and if so, the middle Kurzick team could need a hand because the res shrine has, in my opinion, higher priority then the mesmer or warrior shrine.
Most, if not all times, capture of the res shrine is key for winning the game.
Res shrine in Luxon hands means they have less then half the distance to run to all other shrines, and this removes the advantage Kurzick otherwise have on this map.
Therefore, if res shrine is in danger go to res shrine and take warrior shrine afterwards ;)

I agree that Luxon may run to the mesmer shrine, but a few luxons between Kurzick base and the res shrine in Kurzick hands are of little danger, since their death sends them back to base and not the centre res shrine.

Juiced
02-01-2008, 17:12
It really depends on the situation what is best. If the middle team takes and keeps the res shrine, stop the Luxons heading for the mesmer one, if they don't, help them out at the res shrine and let the Luxons take the mesmer shrine. However, u have no clue if the middle team is capable of keeping the middle, and if more than 1 group of Luxons is going for the middle. So people often just go to the ressurection shrine and make sure it's safe, before heading to the other shrines.

I normally check for the opponents at the warrior shrine if I go to the mesmer shrine at start. If there are 2 elementalists and I'm on my mesmer, I wait for them to head for the mesmer shrine and try to stop them, because I can't resist interupting them :sad:

Zalis
03-01-2008, 18:45
Honestly, being a Luxon, I go whichever way the Kurzicks don't in that situation. Pitching a team-vs-team battle between capture points, especially at the beginning of the match, is usually a bad idea. (at least in an AB PUG) Regardless of who wins there, neither team is capping.

Juiced
04-01-2008, 13:00
Honestly, being a Luxon, I go whichever way the Kurzicks don't in that situation. Pitching a team-vs-team battle between capture points, especially at the beginning of the match, is usually a bad idea. (at least in an AB PUG) Regardless of who wins there, neither team is capping.
If I manage to kill ur team, I can go on capping while u have to respawn at base (if we have the ressurection shrine). Especially if u kill pug groups, they go out and wander off alone after being ressurected, making them less effective. Besides the fact that if we have middle, that means in this case mesmer shrine is safe for a while as well.

I like to pitch a team-vs-team battle at the beginning, if I think we can win it.

Zalis
04-01-2008, 15:16
I like to pitch a team-vs-team battle at the beginning, if I think we can win it.

I don't trust my PUGs enough to bother forcing it. It's another story w/ friends of guildies, especially when voice chat is involved.

SchvagnumPI
09-01-2008, 02:28
....Their idiots?

Would of been my first guess.
Ignorance is bliss I guess.

If my Kurz team is on this side, I go to rez for 2 reasons.
1. Re-enforce the middle group to make sure the shrine is capped.
2. When the Luxs move to Mez shrine you can move into warrior shrine and cap it while they are still on the move/capping.

From there it is a matter of following them and capping behind them to maintain your lead.

Jaimes Laig Romarto
13-01-2008, 13:20
Res shrine is the most important one to have.
Make sure you have it at the start and you wont have any problems capping back the mesmer (which is the weakest one) or warrior one.

shardfenix
14-01-2008, 07:09
....Their idiots?
Please learn how to spell second-grade words before calling other people idiots.

Ora
14-01-2008, 08:30
If I manage to kill ur team, I can go on capping while u have to respawn at base (if we have the ressurection shrine). Especially if u kill pug groups, they go out and wander off alone after being ressurected, making them less effective. Besides the fact that if we have middle, that means in this case mesmer shrine is safe for a while as well.

I like to pitch a team-vs-team battle at the beginning, if I think we can win it.

that and: killing a pug team often means splitting it up. Thus: epic mob battles: no, quick team kills: yes.

chirthain
15-01-2008, 10:54
Ignorance is bliss I guess.

If my Kurz team is on this side, I go to rez for 2 reasons.
1. Re-enforce the middle group to make sure the shrine is capped.
2. When the Luxs move to Mez shrine you can move into warrior shrine and cap it while they are still on the move/capping.

From there it is a matter of following them and capping behind them to maintain your lead.
If the middle group does it's job, it'll cap the res shrine before the luxons are even near it. And with 2 monks, it won't be a problem to win against 4 luxons.

And, the warrior shrine is harder to cap, so the luxons will cap the mesmer shrine before you can cap the warrior.

SchvagnumPI
16-01-2008, 01:48
And, the warrior shrine is harder to cap, so the luxons will cap the mesmer shrine before you can cap the warrior.
If you're with a half decent pug you should have atleast cleared the shrine while the other team is still in transition to the next shrine. IMHO warrior shrine is over rated because you can't nuke it it well.

chirthain
16-01-2008, 09:08
If you're with a half decent pug you should have atleast cleared the shrine while the other team is still in transition to the next shrine. IMHO warrior shrine is over rated because you can't nuke it it well.

Maybe, but you're not walking straight to the warrior shrine, because then you'll encounter the luxon team..

SchvagnumPI
17-01-2008, 04:51
Maybe, but you're not walking straight to the warrior shrine, because then you'll encounter the luxon team..Correct, but you should be on the warriors by the time they get to the valley part near the mesmers.

chirthain
17-01-2008, 16:15
Correct, but you should be on the warriors by the time they get to the valley part near the mesmers.

Mja.. that's just a matter of speedboosts. And the capping will go faster if you have a nuker. That's with both shrines.

Konphujun
04-04-2008, 21:58
At grenz, I find myself (kurzick) taking the left side more often than not because if I don't we tend to lose all three shrines on that side, since people like to fight the group capping the warrior shrine and lose because of the number advantage. What I generally do, is go mesmer, than diagnally to the ranger shrine, than back the warrrior shrine. You usually end up with a 2 to 1 shrine advantage that way, as the Luxons that capped the ranger shrine tend to join up with the group that took the ele shrine and form a mob. Try it out for yourself. It works.

Alleji
07-04-2008, 22:01
Sending two teams to win the initial skirmish over the res shrine isn't really effective, because in my experience the team that capped mes will almost always fall back on the res shrine and cap it after the two kurzick teams left (as a mob).

chirthain
07-05-2008, 19:28
At grenz, I find myself (kurzick) taking the left side more often than not because if I don't we tend to lose all three shrines on that side, since people like to fight the group capping the warrior shrine and lose because of the number advantage. What I generally do, is go mesmer, than diagnally to the ranger shrine, than back the warrrior shrine. You usually end up with a 2 to 1 shrine advantage that way, as the Luxons that capped the ranger shrine tend to join up with the group that took the ele shrine and form a mob. Try it out for yourself. It works.Hm, that sounds pretty interesting. I'll try it out.

Kendel
08-05-2008, 01:15
Sending two teams to win the initial skirmish over the res shrine isn't really effective, because in my experience the team that capped mes will almost always fall back on the res shrine and cap it after the two kurzick teams left (as a mob).

Thats because your 2 teams who capped the res shrine were lacking sense. Holding the res shrine in Grenz/Eternan is the key to winning, quick access to the 3 far shrines if you die is a huge advantage. The second team that capped it doesn't have to rush forward with the other... nothing stopping them going back to stop the other team who are probably about to try and cap the shrine next to it.

Mister Smartypants
08-05-2008, 10:40
If my Kurz team is on this side, I go to rez for 2 reasons.
1. Re-enforce the middle group to make sure the shrine is capped.
2. When the Luxs move to Mez shrine you can move into warrior shrine and cap it while they are still on the move/capping.

From there it is a matter of following them and capping behind them to maintain your lead.

That's the one. The bold part is the key.

It's entirely possible for one luxon team to (a) get to res before the kurz and cap it first, or (b) win vs a 4-man team and the NPC monk if the kurzicks got there first, if the kurzicks don't send two teams to res. I should know, I've done it often enough as a luxon. All it takes is for the middle team to be weak and alone and that's it, red res shrine.

Akirai Annuvil
08-05-2008, 15:28
Grentz?
Kurzick:
Left/Right Gate
Move around all the way to the back. If another team is already capping ranger shrine, move towards res shrine. If not, check which is the easiest cap: ranger/res, cap the easiest -- after that proceed to cap the remaining shrine.
Centre Gate
Cap res orb shrine. Cap res shrine. Cap ranger shrine. Move to assist left or right team.

http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q122/Akirai1989/Guild%20Wars/GrenzFrontiertactics.jpg
Note: map is etnaran keys, luxon point of view, but it's functionally the same as grenz, kurzick pov.

The above is a basic tactical outlay. It is of course subject to change on the basis of battle to battle differences, but assuming it's all going okay with nothing unusual, that's the plan to adher to.

Kendel
09-05-2008, 00:26
That's the one. The bold part is the key.

It's entirely possible for one luxon team to (a) get to res before the kurz and cap it first, or (b) win vs a 4-man team and the NPC monk if the kurzicks got there first, if the kurzicks don't send two teams to res. I should know, I've done it often enough as a luxon. All it takes is for the middle team to be weak and alone and that's it, red res shrine.

Getting to the res shrine before the opponents on your favoured map does usually happen though. Tends to need an entire team with speed boosts and a bit of slowness on your side to get there second. But yeah going to the res shrine (just aslong as all 3 don't end up there) to give support is usually a huge benefit. I tend to avoid the Ele shrine if i have to go right. Usually don't have a monk in the team and that shrine + team or team + single ele can be nasty. After you've made sure the res shrine is held you can rush to Ranger or Ele shrine anyway, only problem is it leaves a team behind you.