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  1. #21
    Everyone always forgets the passives. If you're Healing or Protecting (NOT with Divine Boon), Word of Healing and Restore Condition simulate absolutely ridiculous quantities of energy. Restore Condition is situational dependent on area, obviously, but few are the late game areas (IE, those where you HAVE elite skills) that are conditionless. Ever use it in Ring of Fire? You can actually get a net health gain by having people stand in Lava Pools.

    Word of Healing, when used properly, can be compared extremely favorably to Heal Other. Essentially, every time you cast a powered up Word, you have simulated gaining five energy. Obviously, this only happens frequently when people are frequently below half health, but that's really the only time you should need "energy management". At a recharge of, I believe, four seconds, you can realistically cast it every five when the going gets tough, which means it "gains" fifteen energy every fifteen seconds (quite Offering of Blood-esque, no?), twenty every twenty, or a whopping twenty-five every twenty five, to compare with both Drain and Mantra of Recall. The merits of Drain come mainly in PvP, where you can assault the other team's energy supply if you want, but it's still solid "management" in PvE. I can't stand Mantra myself, but that doesn't mean it doesn't look good on paper. Word is very close to (or far beyond) everything in terms of raw energy, but it has MORE merits (as does Restore Condition). Perhaps most obviously, this means you don't have to burn ten-ish ranks in an alternate attribute, which in turn means one of two things; your healing/protecting skills are more effective (which means each energy point is more effective--I don't want to crunch the numbers here, but let's put it at a conservative five percent. This means that for every twenty energy you "gain" via word, you've effectively gained twenty-one via a non-Monk skill--which really adds up over long outings). OR you can invest those points into something else you want, like Earth Magic for Wards if you want (I don't know that I'd advise this, but the option is there).

    People confuse "energy management" with "gaining energy" far, far too often. In PvP, the distinction can become necessary with that annoying fellow in the brightly colored pants who won't leave you alone (although I argue that it's not, as can be evidenced by the (fairly) recent adoption of Word of Healing into a lot of PvP-oriented eight-man builds.) Gaining energy is NEVER as efficient as real energy management, which includes not only the skills you bring, but wise use of them. I've seen Monks run out of energy ten seconds into a battle because they put Breeze all over anyone who looks like they MIGHT take damage, then begin to spam their empty energy bars while I proceed to keep everyone alive for the next five minutes (and beyond of course). There really is an art to it, as I post every-so-often. The simplest part of it is to just stop healing people who don't need to be healed. I know this is hard to understand, and many people feel that it is their job, their obligation, and even the reason for their character's existence to keep those red bars full. This is not far from the truth, but the distinction is quite important. Your actual job (as a healing/protecting Monk, not as some other support role, such as the oft-maligned Smiting Monk) is to keep those red bars from being empty. Equipment that functions slightly better at greater than half health aside, characters function just as well at one health as at full health. Please note that I say characters here, and not players. Most players will lock up or panic and start doing stupid things if you let them get that low and leave them that way. Depending on how much your group trusts you, you can maintain efficiency even when health bars drop WAAAAY down, to the thirty, twenty, even ten percent marks. Don't keep them full; just keep them from being empty.

    There are of course other tricks of the trade, but that one will likely take you the furthest. A good Monk can keep a reasonably large party alive on two or three healing skills. How much of your bar do you actively use in battle? I use ALL of mine except the resurrect, but only carry two, maybe three direct heals (Word, Heal Other/Infuse Health, possibly Orison depending on area/party size). I ALWAYS bring Hex and Condition removal, because I know no one else does. If I really wanted to, though, these could easily be some other utility, such as Weaken Armor if we're boss hunting. That's irrelevant. The point is you really don't need that much on your bar devoted to healing if you know where to send the stuff. I've also taken to carrying Heal Party in one of the yet-empty slots of late. As long as you don't lean on it to heal that one guy who ran away, you'll be fine. Use it only when necessary AND when it's possible (people won't die within casting time) and it is actually extremely efficient. The same is true of Protective Spirit, even without Protection Prayers. Healing Seed is also VERY good. I platoon all of these, with others, depending on the area, when I am playing straight Healing Prayers. I play many other builds, but I felt this one was most relevant to the current topic.

    Energy Management can take many forms, not just the five or six popular versions that actively gain energy. A good Monk uses skills, knowledge, positioning, and many more factors to both keep people alive and his energy full. A good Monk can take a bad build (within reason) and heal better, for longer than a bad Monk with a perfect build (if such a thing exists).

    I guess I've drifted away from the topic at hand a little. The original point was that you should consider non-gaining "energy management skills". Signet of Devotion is the only one I often see praised as such, but there are many. Healing Seed, Heal Party, Signets of Devotion and Rejuvenation, Dispel Hexes, and even the mighty Protective Spirit can be used to simulate enormous quantities of energy when applied properly, and that's just on the primary healer.

    --me

  2. #22
    Thats all very nice corporal, but we are kinda talking more about the PvP application of keeping your energy up. Your way of 'energy management' with only using skills when they are necesary like the word of healing example are really handy in PvE, and are sometimes applicable for PvP, but not against good teams.
    The way of 'energy management' you describe here is good for short term battles, like a PvE monster group of whatever size, but in PvP for example dark chamber in HoH, ive battled good groups for 10-15 minutes, and on those long term battles, its not the 'knowledge of knowing when to use skills' only that will save the day.
    For that reason, people have to use skills like Edrain, channeling, ..... to keep their energy at a level which is required to heal for longer times.
    For each kind of play (PvE, GvG, HoH) youll need different types of skills, and with that different types of 'energy management' for monks. IMO, in PvE, you can take whatever you want, its not that hard to survive a enemy if your even half a decent monk. In PvP, its a bit more difficult, and most of the time, the capability of the monks will decide the battle. With capability, i mean everything, like positioning, using right skills on right people, on right time, and having a good skill-setup. And if you like it or not, but in PvP, energy management in the form of an energy gain skill is needed.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Seph
    Thats all very nice corporal, but we are kinda talking more about the PvP application of keeping your energy up. Your way of 'energy management' with only using skills when they are necesary like the word of healing example are really handy in PvE, and are sometimes applicable for PvP, but not against good teams.
    The way of 'energy management' you describe here is good for short term battles, like a PvE monster group of whatever size, but in PvP for example dark chamber in HoH, ive battled good groups for 10-15 minutes, and on those long term battles, its not the 'knowledge of knowing when to use skills' only that will save the day.
    For that reason, people have to use skills like Edrain, channeling, ..... to keep their energy at a level which is required to heal for longer times.
    For each kind of play (PvE, GvG, HoH) youll need different types of skills, and with that different types of 'energy management' for monks. IMO, in PvE, you can take whatever you want, its not that hard to survive a enemy if your even half a decent monk. In PvP, its a bit more difficult, and most of the time, the capability of the monks will decide the battle. With capability, i mean everything, like positioning, using right skills on right people, on right time, and having a good skill-setup. And if you like it or not, but in PvP, energy management in the form of an energy gain skill is needed.

    Lets not forget most use MoR.
    You seem to harp on Edrain and Channeling which is all good... just pick one that suits your play style and your good to go.
    Before OoB was nerfed it was the best.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by NeVeRLiFt
    Lets not forget most use MoR.
    You seem to harp on Edrain and Channeling which is all good... just pick one that suits your play style and your good to go.
    Before OoB was nerfed it was the best.
    Yea, absolutely agreed, before OoB got the nerf, it was used by 100% of the boon-prots in gvg. But after it got nerfed, part of players went in the direction of MoR, and part of players went for Edrain. At start, i played with MoR as well, but i switched to Edrain short while after that, because i thought it was better.

  5. #25
    Thanks for the input guys. I appreciate it. So far what ive gotten:

    E-Drain: Quick energy gain, fairly constant if on a logical target and takes their energy... but its an elite and has the potential to have subpar replenishment

    MoR: Constant Source of Energy that can also be used as a cover enchant. Can be CoPed away to get energy, health, and hex/condition removal... but is also elite, must use another skill to get the energy for it OR wait for opponent to shatter/drain OR wait the 20 seconds.

    Chanelling: I hate Chanelling (sp?) personally. Some people swear by it. Same benefits as MoR except energy isnt constant and requires you to cast to gain energy... minimal energy. Unreliable gains, must be in view of multiple enemies to be successful, and can also be shattered/drained and such.

    Power Drain: Most Energy gain for the energy spent. Interupts a target that could potentially save other players health/energy, which i find better than just the energy depletion and not an elite... but it must be against someone whos using a spell and you must be able to interupt it. So many times ive used it on an RoF or lightning strike and missed it. Tough to get energy from it in a reasonable amount of time.... though if used right very effective

    Management: Basically just being smart. That comes with experience and all, but as others said, in PvP you're going to run out of energy, simple as that. And when you do your team is dead. You need to restore energy, but this here doesnt take up skill slots and saves energy for as long as possible.

    OoB: Best energy gain for the effort you have to put into it... but its elite and sacs life. Also, its necromancer skill, and most groups look an Mo/N and Mo/Me and take the Mo/Me first, as that is what is known as the reliable, basic monk build.

    All others: Everything else i saw was Factions, which i dont have so i cant comment on them.

    Once again, thanks guys. I guess it depends on my current build and if im able to take elites or CoP/others or not. A lot of good info here though

  6. #26
    Seanachie
    Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by nightrunner
    Energy Drain is fairly easy to use, you can use it on pretty much anybody. It also has the bonus of draining an enemy's energy. On the other hand, sometimes you might not get your money's worth if your target was low on energy. It's also Elite.

    Power Drain is sort of the "elite monk" skill. On paper, it's very powerful - at 1 Inspiration, that's 16 energy every 25 seconds. However, the drawback is that it's very difficult to use to it's full potential. It takes a lot of concentration to be able to heal your team at the same time as watch the enemy for spells to inturrupt.

    You also might want to take a look at Mantra of Recall, another popular energy management skill.

    think i like the energy drain better of the two listed...

  7. #27
    I have started using Blessed Light in PvE since capping it.
    Really nice elite imho, only thing is in PvE with pugs I like OoB... so I usually ask the group which they prefer.
    With henchmen I don't use OoB and Blessed Light is great skill to use in my chain of skills that I spam to keep me alive.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Seef II
    For a healing monk, Word of Healing's all you really need in PvE. Signet of Rejuvenation is also okay, but is on a long recharge (for a monk).
    Perfect though to heal a warrior with since you'll usually get the conditional heal as well.
    Quote Originally Posted by Seef II
    Active prots generally get by with restore condition in most areas.
    I prefer using it with a Boon Prot in PvE. 7 energy can net 200+ heals on a regular basis in several areas.

  9. #29
    although power drain is great for energy management i dont think its worth the extra maintenance. as hte monk has to worry about keeping himself and his team alive at teh same time, clearing hexes...in addition to MOC/energy drain.

    altho if you want to keep less maintenance, you could probably conjuction it with arcane conundrum + power drain...but then the drawback is you have 2 less skill slots you could use other useful skills for.

    another drawback is if you wind up facing an all physical team, the spell is mostly useless as their are no targets to drain from, unless their secondary includes spellcasting. But with all the heat from 4 warriors/assasins on you butt, i dont think you have the time to worry about power draining any skills they use.

  10. #30
    Well my Monk is Mo/E and I prefer the old fashioned divine spirit +glyph of renewal for energy

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