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Thread: Size of Tyria

  1. #1

    Size of Tyria

    Even though my last thread on the topic didn't get much of a response I decided to continue my estimations of the size of parts of our GW world.

    This was my method. I found a long, uninterrupted distance in Old Ascalon to run. I picked it because of the ease of killing things in my way. One assumption I made is that Vertical difference doesn't change the horizontal speed* I ran for precisely 20 seconds. Next I found the distance ratio between how far I ran and a larger stretch on the zoomed in World Map (1:7)** Then I found the ratio between that stretch and the overall dimensions of the world map (1:16.5 vert and 1:19.5 horiz)*** Some math later, I found the time to run the full length of the map to be 38.5 minutes vertically, and 45.5 minutes horizontally. Now, this corresponds to an incredibly small map. The fastest marathons (unofficial records here) ever ran are around 2 hours. So, given that our characters never get tired etc. the world map is about 8 miles across, and slightly less vertically.

    End message: This place is tiny, but larger than cantha on a ratio of about 1.35:1. This ratio is an additional confirmation of the accuracy of my determinations, as the aspect ratios of the two maps should be equal, and then the ratio of vertical to vertical should equal the ratio of horizontal to horizontal. In my case they differ by about .1 which is not too bad considering my methods.


    EDIT: Added Pictures
    *I made this assumption based on a few trials, and that there is no Z-axis in the guild wars universe, the map moves under the player, the character model isn't actually moving at all.
    **Zoomed in World Map



    ***World Map



    ****Error analysis, see other thread, the error analysis is the same.
    Last edited by Ranger Nietzsche; 31-08-2006 at 22:27.

  2. #2
    It is interesting...how about a link to the other thread? :)

  3. #3
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    How can you tell how fast you ran, or how long the distance was? Assumptions are a poor basis for mathimatics.

    As for the distance the blue line shows, why would people need boats for distances that can easily be swum in under 3 minutes?

    This whole thing is rather hard to swallow, in my opinion. But I'm not saying you are wrong, simply that it is not proportional.
    |||Quintus Antonius Adepphius Philologus Tyrianicus Canthacus Elonacus Durheimus|||

  4. #4
    i don't think theres really ever been any doubt that Tyria is tiny

  5. #5
    Well, there is the obvious issues here with this endeavour, particularly the application of normal world measuring systems, such as time, to the tyrian world. Still, it is apparant from this that characters, when allowed to move in a straight line, are able to to traverse large portions of the map very quickly.

    I find this attempted to be quite interresting, as it allowes an accurate estimation of the diference in relative size between different lands, a useful thing to be able to do.

    The application of things like "miles" to the map, however, is not very appealing, since taken literally it greatly decreases the apperant size of the world. I very much doubt that any one will take seriously the implication of this finding Lion's Arch and Ascalon are only 4 miles away from each other as the crow flies. It does not jive with other things that we know from the game itself.

    Although it is still interresting to think about the map from a real world perspective. Its curious to think that the game space has aquired enough of a reality for us to want to consider it as a real space, measurable human minutes...

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Quintus Antonius
    How can you tell how fast you ran, or how long the distance was? Assumptions are a poor basis for mathimatics.

    As for the distance the blue line shows, why would people need boats for distances that can easily be swum in under 3 minutes?

    This whole thing is rather hard to swallow, in my opinion. But I'm not saying you are wrong, simply that it is not proportional.
    Firstly, the distance in this case was measured in reality as a measure of time over distance. It would be very difficult to determine the average speed of a guild wars character which is why I didn't do that. I don't know how fast I ran or how long the distance was. I only know the ratio of time to that unit distance is 20sec:1unit distance. I also know the ratio of that unit distance to a larger distance is 1:7. Finally I know the ratio of that larger distance to the full world map to be 1:19.5. Multiply the ratios, units cancel and you get 45.5 minutes per unit world map.

    If you find a problem with my methods other than your disagreement with the results please say so.

    I measured the distance as a distance relative to time, IE the distance one travels in 20 seconds. That blue line is nearly exactly 7 times the distance one covers in 20 seconds of running in guild wars.

    The accurate part of this is the time it takes to run the map, 45.5 minutes and 38.5 minutes. The milage is a rough estimation based on normal human running speed over long distances (marathons) and is, admittedly very inaccurate because our characters run faster than normal humans.

    As for applying Earth time to tyrian time, Earth time = tyrian time. This is proven over several instances: countdown times in pvp maps, canthan bonus times, the 10 minute timer for keeping the ghost alive in Dunes of Despair mission.

    To repeat, the important part of this is simply that it takes a guild wars character roughly 45 minutes to traverse the entire world map from edge to edge. This is verifiable over several trials. How this fits in with our view of Tyria is something I leave to others to explain.
    Last edited by Ranger Nietzsche; 01-09-2006 at 16:49.

  7. #7
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    Earth time does not equal Tyrian time. You have no idea how long those 10 minutes are to the characters. A clear indication of this is in the Eternal Grove Kurzick Factions mission. After fighting for just 20 minutes (or less depending on your pace), Danika says, "We've been fighting for an hour", when the time percieved by the player is actually much less.

    What I question, is not your calculations, but rather, your methodology. I could be wrong, and completely off base here, but have you done trials in several different areas of Tyria? For instance, clear an area of the Crystal Desert, and repeat the same test. Go to the Maguum Jungle, or the flat areas near Lion's Arch and do the same thing. Run the Northern Shiverpeaks (which is basically a straight line), and test that. I'm guessing that all the times will come up different because we simply do not have a set unit or speed on which to measure.
    |||Quintus Antonius Adepphius Philologus Tyrianicus Canthacus Elonacus Durheimus|||

  8. #8
    Actually quintus, when I said multiple trials I meant exactly that.

    I did in fact run a section of the desert, the northern shiverpeaks, and kryta.

    The same distance was covered in 20 seconds as in ascalon.

    Our characters run at the same speed regardless of where they are. And IMO it would be absurd to assume otherwise as footstep intervals are consistent everywhere and to believe our characters run at different speeds in different maps would mean our World Map is an incredibly inaccurate Time-Space distorted lumpy mess.
    Last edited by Ranger Nietzsche; 01-09-2006 at 17:35.

  9. #9
    Hrm... how about using something like wells as was originally proposed, or scorpion wire? This would give an actual foot-measure, and would eliminate the assumtion that it is being run at marathon speed and additional time-distance caluclations, reducing error.

    I do agree that you run at the same horizontal speed on flats and up hills, though.

  10. #10
    good idea, although the wells wont work as the descriptions have removed the feet definition.

    *edit*
    Testing completed. Using Scorpion Wire. Over 25 trials, our characters move at a speed of about 25 Tyrian feet per earth second. Admittedly faster than I anticipated.

    Which gives us: 68,250 Tyrian feet (12.93 Tyrian miles) East-West and 57,750 Tyrian Feet (10.94 Tyrian miles) North-South



    Scorpion wire description: For 8...18 seconds, the next time you and target foe are more than 100' apart, you teleport to that foe and that foe is knocked down. This spell has half the normal range.
    Last edited by Ranger Nietzsche; 01-09-2006 at 18:21.

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