The challenge of the new HA

[Bacon]

Yet, half of what you do in HA is interrupt a NPC GHOST

And half of what you do in gvg is killing npcs.

What does interupting a ghost have to do with the rest of the matches? You're not using the ghost as one of your players, you're using him to cap the alter (if its even an alter match.) Half of HA is interupting? 3/8 of the maps require interupting a ghostly. And thats only if you let your ghost die after he's capped.

Where did GvG come from... Little different than HA.

Huh heroes are designed by people, they're build around people, and their choice of skills. You are fighting against another player, not like the hero is there on their own. Not to mention ppl are micromanaging these heroes some what.

It's like saying RTS game isn't PvP because it isn't FPS and you aren't directly fighting the person but rather the units controlled by the other player. Don't be stupid. Even if the units in RTS has a certain autonomy it doesn't mean you aren't fighting the person behind those units.

Hey you know what, these bots are better than the mindless zombies that made up the Iway and Vimway groups. Much better. At least you get to run your own builds rather than given these 3 choices

1) Create your own guild and boss everybody around (yea right)
2) Wait forever for the right PuG
3) Join the Iway group.

If you can't win vs. bots you suck. Their AI is pretty horrible, they like to run around like headless chicken.

Yet strangely enough, they're still better than 70% (if not more) of random GW players out there.

Leave the bots alone.

People aren't micromanaging as much as you think. Tell me, when they load up a ranger with interupts, is it the person interupting 1/4 cast spells? I highly doubt that. Are they controlling the monk with immediate heals and prots when someone even starts taking damage? I highly doubt that as well.

RTS doesn't involve bots. The units don't do anything unless YOU tell them to do something. You're doing everything; what to build, where to go, what to attack, what skills to use at what time. Bots use AI. They use something when its logical to use it.

Their AI is NOT horrible, either. At certain times, their AI can surpass the human ability to play. I want you to play a monk, and while healing during a huge pressure spike affecting 2-3 people at once, find a target casting a 1 second spell as soon as you even select the target, interupt it, and continue healing through it. Sure, they're easy to beat, but the AI can be incredibly good at times.

So which would you have more fun doing. Killing bots and winning, or killing other human opponents and winning? That's what the problem is. PvP is meant for defeating other HUMAN teams, not farming off bots with one person doing practically nothing.

[Malchiel]

What does interupting a ghost have to do with the rest of the matches? You're not using the ghost as one of your players, you're using him to cap the alter (if its even an alter match.) Half of HA is interupting? 3/8 of the maps require interupting a ghostly. And thats only if you let your ghost die after he's capped.

Where did GvG come from... Little different than HA.




People aren't micromanaging as much as you think. Tell me, when they load up a ranger with interupts, is it the person interupting 1/4 cast spells? I highly doubt that. Are they controlling the monk with immediate heals and prots when someone even starts taking damage? I highly doubt that as well.

RTS doesn't involve bots. The units don't do anything unless YOU tell them to do something. You're doing everything; what to build, where to go, what to attack, what skills to use at what time. Bots use AI. They use something when its logical to use it.

Their AI is NOT horrible, either. At certain times, their AI can surpass the human ability to play. I want you to play a monk, and while healing during a huge pressure spike affecting 2-3 people at once, find a target casting a 1 second spell as soon as you even select the target, interupt it, and continue healing through it. Sure, they're easy to beat, but the AI can be incredibly good at times.

So which would you have more fun doing. Killing bots and winning, or killing other human opponents and winning? That's what the problem is. PvP is meant for defeating other HUMAN teams, not farming off bots with one person doing practically nothing.

No doubt as far as interrupting concerned the AIs are insane. But besides that... they suck. AI monks have little to no concept of energy management. They tend to over heal, wasting even more energy.

When attacked they run around without any real sense of direction. Running into traps, running too short and coming back again instead of trul kiting and so on.

Given peace and harmony they don't even know to put it on the other monk.

And the list just goes on. Yes AIs are crazy good when it comes to interrupting but anything else they're just plain indiscriminate to downright stupid.

Still AI is not horrible if you consider the majority of GW players. Leave them alone I want to be able to go HA w/o waiting an hour or more for a pug or join Iway team. Worse PUG balance team in HA is dead anyways. You take an hour to form one and they play like total noobs. At least with IWAY you don't have to take as long to form a group and usually got much further than "balanced"

Besides I don't want some random stranger in my team if I could help it. May be as an ally, but not in my team. I just don't know what they'll do. I want to know and dictate every skill that's to be run in my team. I just can't do that with human players without a lot of haggling and whining. Often not even then. Even with guildies humans don't take orders very well. And they won't play the build that you want most of the time.

Look humans suck, they're too noisy and most of them aren't even that great. So why spend an hour trying to recruit them to my team when I can just hench it?

Now if they'll just remove the blue glow around AIs that'd be perfect. So none can tell if it's Allesia the player or Allesia the hench.

[Bacon]

No doubt as far as interrupting concerned the AIs are insane. But besides that... they suck. AI monks have little to no concept of energy management. They tend to over heal, wasting even more energy.

When attacked they run around without any real sense of direction. Running into traps, running too short and coming back again instead of trul kiting and so on.

Given peace and harmony they don't even know to put it on the other monk.

And the list just goes on. Yes AIs are crazy good when it comes to interrupting but anything else they're just plain indiscriminate to downright stupid.

Still AI is not horrible if you consider the majority of GW players. Leave them alone I want to be able to go HA w/o waiting an hour or more for a pug or join Iway team. Worse PUG balance team in HA is dead anyways. You take an hour to form one and they play like total noobs. At least with IWAY you don't have to take as long to form a group and usually got much further than "balanced"

Besides I don't want some random stranger in my team if I could help it. May be as an ally, but not in my team. I just don't know what they'll do. I want to know and dictate every skill that's to be run in my team. I just can't do that with human players without a lot of haggling and whining. Often not even then. Even with guildies humans don't take orders very well. And they won't play the build that you want most of the time.

Look humans suck, they're too noisy and most of them aren't even that great. So why spend an hour trying to recruit them to my team when I can just hench it?

Now if they'll just remove the blue glow around AIs that'd be perfect. So none can tell if it's Allesia the player or Allesia the hench.

Yes the monks overheal, but give them channeling, and they should be good to go due to running into groups. Besides monks, the AI isn't really that bad. I've seen an ele start spiking a warrior who just used frenzy, little things like that. The main problem with the AI is interupting is just too good.

I guess from the lower ranked non experienced person's side of it, the heroes can be a good thing. But the people who actually want to play other humans in HA are getting screwed over due too all these hero/hench teams. It's simply not fun anymore. The 6v6 limited creativity, which was bad enough. Now that more than half of HA is one person teams, it just lowers the enjoyment to practically nothing.

[Malchiel]

Yes the monks overheal, but give them channeling, and they should be good to go due to running into groups. Besides monks, the AI isn't really that bad. I've seen an ele start spiking a warrior who just used frenzy, little things like that. The main problem with the AI is interupting is just too good.

I guess from the lower ranked non experienced person's side of it, the heroes can be a good thing. But the people who actually want to play other humans in HA are getting screwed over due too all these hero/hench teams. It's simply not fun anymore. The 6v6 limited creativity, which was bad enough. Now that more than half of HA is one person teams, it just lowers the enjoyment to practically nothing.

There's a reason why I don't go to HA a lot. See how many advertisements for IWAY and ViMWAY there was? At least pre vimway nerf anyways.

There're tons. You can't even play the build you like.

The other problem is dealing with people. I simply don't have the time nor patience to deal with them in my team. If I could help it, I want them to shut up, and play like I tell them to. I can't do that with ppl. Well AIs are stupid but at least they obey my orders to a fault I'd give them that.

Look when I play Pee Vee Pee... I want to f-i-g-h-t another player in another team and NOT the one in my own team. But usually that's what end up happening when you have humans in your own team.

At least if the AI did something stupid it's justifiable since their... well... AI. At the worst I can just blame it all on myself since I control them after all. But when a human player do something stupid, repeatedly to boot... how do you justify something like that? and you end up throwing insult at each other. Not exactly my idea of fun, really.

[Bacon]

There's a reason why I don't go to HA a lot. See how many advertisements for IWAY and ViMWAY there was? At least pre vimway nerf anyways.

There're tons. You can't even play the build you like.

The other problem is dealing with people. I simply don't have the time nor patience to deal with them in my team. If I could help it, I want them to shut up, and play like I tell them to. I can't do that with ppl. Well AIs are stupid but at least they obey my orders to a fault I'd give them that.

Look when I play Pee Vee Pee... I want to f-i-g-h-t another player in another team and NOT the one in my own team. But usually that's what end up happening when you have humans in your own team.

At least if the AI did something stupid it's justifiable since their... well... AI. At the worst I can just blame it all on myself since I control them after all. But when a human player do something stupid, repeatedly to boot... how do you justify something like that? and you end up throwing insult at each other. Not exactly my idea of fun, really.

I guess that's the main difference between the views of it. The PvE'rs and newer people don't have the guilds and friends lists full of people they can use to put a build together like us more experienced people do. The simplest way to solve this would be to change it back to the old 8v8, and implement a LFG system for it.

[nightrunner]

HA is supposed to be a high level arena (kind of a joke, now). It's supposed to be about competitive, organized teams that want to win, not "just get 6 players and hit enter mission." There's not much you can do about cookie-cutter builds like ViMway, since they'll always exist, once one gets nerfed another will be discovered. But stuff like henchway can be removed.

Guilds that can't get enough people for HA, or people that don't want to play at that level should go to Team Arena. I realize that TA is also pretty stupid, but dumbing down HA is not the solution to the problem. IMO it would be a lot better if HA went back to 8v8, and TA was revamped to make it fun to play.

[Bacon]

HA is supposed to be a high level arena (kind of a joke, now). It's supposed to be about competitive, organized teams that want to win, not "just get 6 players and hit enter mission." There's not much you can do about cookie-cutter builds like ViMway, since they'll always exist, once one gets nerfed another will be discovered. But stuff like henchway can be removed.

Guilds that can't get enough people for HA, or people that don't want to play at that level should go to Team Arena. I realize that TA is also pretty stupid, but dumbing down HA is not the solution to the problem. IMO it would be a lot better if HA went back to 8v8, and TA was revamped to make it fun to play.

I would definately vote for you for president.

Too bad that's waaaay too much work for Anet.

[slakt]

1. Anet wants more players in HA

2. Most GW players are PvE:ers

3. Anet makes HA PvE

gg

[Wuzzman]

If your a noob Heros are probably your worse enemy. They will ripe you apart before you have a chance to move your nooby brain into focus to even mount a decent counter. If your playing henchway you will probably lose...heros are better then henchiement by 70% due to the ability to have customizable builds. Now if your in a real teams its free fame, simple. The heroes might catch you ever once in a while but you will come out on top 90% of the time.

Heroes are good for pvp. Allows individuals to run builds they want to run and not what some kid who can emote idea of a build. Simply their are plenty of builds I can not get the average pug to play. Why get fustrated with those people and start asking for r3+(this is controdictory to what I said earlier but I have to admit asking for r3+ has made pugging easier when doing 8v8 or 6v6) to even get on my vent, when I can just grab heros/henchies to do the same basic jobs.

[Inner Salbat]

I was going to make a topic about this myself, after playing HA last night and bumping into heroway every damn map, and in some cases flaw lessing them in less than 57seconds.

Let me cut to the chase, I hate hero's in HA they should never have been allowed period, or in GvG period.

We had a warrior interrupted with a 0 second cast time skill, how the hell can you interrupt a skill with 0 cast time ? I mean seriously, as far as I am concerned if they don't kick those damn hero's out of HA & GvG, then I'm just not going to PvP anymore, and my guild (ANZ Army Corps. [Since Guild Wars Chapter 1 beta]) feels pretty much the same way.

The thing with Hero's / Henchmen is that they don't operate like human people which are prone to make errors and mistake, they gank 1 player and then move on to the next one, it now becomes abundantly obvious why they made HA 6v6 now, if they want more people playing HA this isn't the way to go, frankly I think this was done to satisfy the whining nublings that constantly complained about not getting groups because of rank discrimination, or at least in part maybe.

The only safe place to PvP now is RA, they've broken in my opinion one of the funder mental parts of Guild Wars that made this game fun to play, GvG & HA.

When I turn on HA/GvG I expect to be facing people not some AI, AI is for when I play PvE, not PvP.

If you have the CE of nightfall you can play the making of dvd, and you can spot who is to blame for this, moronic idea.