Okay, I've played my paragon a bit but not enough to make a judgement on the matter (meaning not very much). Therefore I ask you experienced paragon players for your help:
Can a paragon act as a healer?
Now, before other people say that the Paragon isn't meant to replace the monk, I'll just say that yes, I know that.
In Factions the ritualist was an excellent complimentary class to the monk, often outright replacing them (i.e. if you can't find a monk you have no problems taking a ritualist who agrees to go restoration). Recent buffs have firmly established the ritualist as a 'healer' class if it chooses to do so, particularly in PvE (PvP a ritualist mostly suffers from mobility issues, but even that is being addressed with NF skills).
Paragons, on the other hand, I'm not so sure. There's not many skills that have the pure healing strength or spammability of ones found in the restoration and healing lines. Even if there were, I'd doubt that their low en regen would be able to toss them out like a caster class.
However, there does seem to be a lot of party-wide chants and echoes that can really protect the team. I've seen a few builds in this forum that really show great ways of reducing overall damage and even healing, but i'm not sure if they are good enough to convince a team to 'take out a monk' as it is. Certainly, I can see a paragon welcome if the party already has 2 healers, but I still wonder if it can replace one.
So there's the question: Can a paragon act as a main healer? (or even protter?)
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Thread: Can Paragons act as a 'healer'?
19-11-2006, 15:18 #1
Can Paragons act as a 'healer'?
19-11-2006, 16:48 #2
The only thing a paragon can't do heal wise is spikeheal, they are excellent with party wide heals and party wide protection. Early on in PvE You just need 1 monk next to a paragon to protect against spikes. Later in the game you'll need either a ritualist, another paragon that protects or a monk that protects alongside that.
19-11-2006, 18:40 #3
Actually, Paragons CAN "spike heal", of a sort. It's a slightly longer lag than a Monk deals with, but it's still fast in a group constructed along certain lines. I've been doing that in my hero/henchie adventuring, actually, and I detailed the build here.
Basically, use Finale of Restoration. At Motivation of 12ish, it lasts something like 33 seconds and heals 88 every time a shout or chant ends, for a cost of only 5e. (It's got a good 10s recharge time, too.) The key, though, is that EVERY member of my group is using lots of group-effect shouts and chants (like "Watch Yourself!" or "Shields Up!" for Warriors). I'm spamming them constantly (and thanks to Energizing Finale, I'm not even losing energy!), all of the heroes have Paragon as a secondary or primary, and I even bring Sogolon. I just got Morgahn, and I set him up almost identical to myself; incidentally, I went into his hero panel, and he's definitely spamming them; EVERY skill was being cast as soon as it came up, so you could probably give him that build when you're on your non-Paragon characters and see a nice return.
So, in any given second, at least one shout is wearing off or activating on each character... which triggers Finales. If you see someone start to take damage, hit them with FoR, and they'll get healed almost immediately, AND they'll be effectively immune to damage for 30 seconds or so. If it recharges and no one's being hurt, stick it on the tank or the healer anyway.
In an 8-man group you won't be the ONLY healer, and there's still plenty of room for a good Monk to be the primary, but you can do a LOT of spot-healing, plus general group healing (Song of Restoration is a FANTASTIC elite.) And you're definitely more durable in your plate armor than they are in their tattoos and pajamas.
19-11-2006, 20:18 #4
Paragon can only spike heal as well as a ritualist, crappy but can.
20-11-2006, 14:26 #5
Paragons can't fill the roll of "healer" in the common sense, but they can provide excellent defense with the right builds and good support healing. But a "healer" would be someone that can heal a few hundred damage right away, just in time to save your butt.
20-11-2006, 17:56 #6
Finale of Restoration is the only skill you can use to cover spikes (effectively). Chant of Restoration is fine, but it only works once per 20 seconds (great party-heal, though).
Finale of Restoration is way too slow for effective use. It'll take at least 2-3 seconds for a shout to expire, and it's a one-second cast. So that's waiting 3-4 seconds for 70 hps? *laf*.
Paragons are much better as a group/support character. You can keep the Monks' energy up, keep WY! on your team, deal some damage, and have healing spells (Mending Refrain, Aria/Song of Restoration).
I've found that the best role is just energy support. Allowing an Elementalist or two to spam Searing Flames constantly as well as allowing your Monks to spam anything they want is actually a useful class slot (unlike a Battery Necro, who couldn't output nearly as much energy as a Motivation Paragon).
20-11-2006, 18:23 #7
Originally Posted by Forbiddian
But in a constructed group (such as in GvG combat, or when PvEing with Heroes), where EVERYONE has shouts/chants with little duplication, there can be more than a dozen shouts or chants on each person at any given time, which means at least one is wearing off each second. Finale kicks in OFTEN. Add Ballad of Restoration, Chorus of Restoration, and especially Song of Restoration (E), and the entire group stays healed while triggering the Finales on those who really need it. While the 10s recharge time means you can't use it on multiple people quickly, the 30+s duration means that unlike a Healing Monk, you never need to chain-cast it on one person; once it's on the tank, he's basically safe for the duration.
Even in a pickup group, you can tell people "I'm playing a Finale build, please bring as many group-effect shouts/chants as you can." If they've ever heard of the concept, they'll do so. Granted, the expansion is still relatively new, and most players don't read boards, but IMO this'll end up like Minion Master or Barrage/Pet, where it's common enough that everyone hears of it eventually.
Think of it more like how a Prot Monk plays (my Monk is Boon Prot, so it felt very familiar). Yes, you can wait to see who's getting hit and cast a prot spell on them (which also heals a bit), OR if no one's in immediate danger, just cast it on the people most likely to be hurt in the near future. If Finale of Restoration is up, and everyone's health bars are near full, put it on a tank anyway.
20-11-2006, 18:52 #8
20-11-2006, 20:54 #9
Actually, anyone saying Paragons spike-heal as well as Ritualists obviously has left their brain in a jar in the basement and shouldnt post here.
Paragons cover the whole party, and thus open up the possibility of a monk being a dedicated spike healer, instead of having to heal each and every little nick someone takes.
For healing, classes are roughly like:
Monk: Spike 80%, Party 20% (even less in some areas due to slow cast)
Ritualist: Spike 50% Party 50%
Paragon: Spike 20% Party 80%
Monks heal very inefficient, and have to rely on outside sources for energy (often paragons or necros) in a lot of cases where the party takes heavy pressure damage.
Ritualists heal extremely efficient, but their biggest heal is just short of 200 (of the ones practical that is, yes I know they have a 300+ party heal too) which isnt enough for the biggest spikes in the game.
Paragons dont heal for more than 90ish, but they do so without real energy loss, and for several targets at once (at least 2 through signet of synergy).
IMO, a party can get along with 2 of these classes, if you have 1 of each, it would make for the best allrounder heal, but due to the spike-heavy pvp environment, monks are usually better suited.
Once pressure builds become used more (it will happen, the metagame shifts now and then) I believe Paragons and Ritualists will be used more in healing roles.
E/Mo heal party spammer doesnt count really, as HP is a pretty sucky spell, it just has insane range which was the reason these builds came up... at least they could do SOMETHING from back behind the lines.
21-11-2006, 15:42 #10
I carry Signet of Synergy for one time spike heals and use song of restoration to cover the party, works fairly well.
I don't know if a paragon can be a primary healer for a full 8 man team, but I think they are very effective as a support healer, for those groups that can only find one monk but want 2.
I have also started carrying energizing finale as a small energy buff for the primary healer.
Last edited by ferralboy; 21-11-2006 at 15:46. Reason: left something off