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  1. #11
    Worst case scenario, reintroduce the fame bug and let it randomly afflict people.

  2. #12
    GWOnline.Net Member mmorpg man's Avatar
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    I think that wuzzman is dam right about implementing a system: it is too late. the problem being that if you try to take away something from a group of people (whether they ever used it or not), they will try to stop you. you all saw what happened when soulreaping got nurfed. the day after half the necro comunity had started a thread about how bad it was. the point is you can't give someone something then take it away from them.

    and btw vela, you're forgetting about [NaNa].

  3. #13
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    I'd have to say this is the first HA fix proposal I've seen that aims to improve HA by reducing the number of players in it. I had no idea that HA had such an overpopulation problem.

    It would be better to try to attract new players and increase the retention rate. I'd propose adding a New Player's Ascent aimed for low-fame players. New Player's Ascent teams would play other New Player's Ascent teams for 1-3 rounds and then advance to Hero's Ascent. The New Player's Ascent rounds would only award fame to low-rank players (higher-ranked players could play there, but those wins would not count towards rewards).

    By matching unskilled teams against unskilled teams, you should achieve a better expected win ratio and promote some learning. You'd also have slightly less discrimination because, hey, everybody in NPA is inexperienced.

  4. #14
    GWOnline.Net Member mmorpg man's Avatar
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    I'd have to say this is the first HA fix proposal I've seen that aims to improve HA by reducing the number of players in it. I had no idea that HA had such an overpopulation problem.

    It would be better to try to attract new players and increase the retention rate. I'd propose adding a New Player's Ascent aimed for low-fame players. New Player's Ascent teams would play other New Player's Ascent teams for 1-3 rounds and then advance to Hero's Ascent. The New Player's Ascent rounds would only award fame to low-rank players (higher-ranked players could play there, but those wins would not count towards rewards).

    By matching unskilled teams against unskilled teams, you should achieve a better expected win ratio and promote some learning. You'd also have slightly less discrimination because, hey, everybody in NPA is inexperienced.
    this has been suggested before and got a luke-warm welcome at best. I think it is a good idea but as wuzzman said, it is too late to implement it and the effects wouldn't be seen for at least 6 months.

  5. #15
    GWOnline.Net Member BabyJ's Avatar
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    Well it's only taken me close to a year to get 14 fame, another 2 or 3 years and i might hit rank 3.

    From my experience there are new people willing to learn but no experienced person is willing to take the time to teach a new person. Instead its a "noob" comment and get their emotes flashed in your face. So yeah, if new people were a little more accepted in HA then there would be new people there. And by that i mean the ones that are willing to learn not the ones that just want an emote to flash around.

  6. #16
    GWOnline.Net Member Savsuds's Avatar
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    BabyJ, the main problem is distinguishing between those willing to learn and those prepared to learn. The prepared have vent/TS/whatever and have used it before, UAX or close enough to play any desired role, know what every skill does and counters to them, Meta knowledge, etc. Most people, myself included lack the desire to train those willing to learn up to my level or the level of my friends (who I only play with). The prepared learner at least has done some of the work necessary so as not to be spoon fed during matches.
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  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmorpg man View Post
    this has been suggested before and got a luke-warm welcome at best. I think it is a good idea but as wuzzman said, it is too late to implement it and the effects wouldn't be seen for at least 6 months.
    I think you'd see an immediate increase in matches-played (within a week) and that some number of the new players attracted would stick around. Without new blood, the HA format will just continue to stagnate.

    Also, if you look at the number of active accounts with any fame versus those with no fame, I'm pretty sure the 0-fame crowd is much, much bigger.

    Assuming your goal is to grow the HA population, you simply must attract the 0-fame crowd.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by simplicity View Post
    I'd propose adding a New Player's Ascent aimed for low-fame players.
    You could have some way of measuring PvP skill, and roughly match players and teams according to it. One easy way to do that is to use the already-existing titles.

    So when I get into HA, it is more likely that I'll fight teams with low-fame than teams that are r6+. I'll still bump into high-rank teams, but not as often, especially not in the first few matches.

    Keep some element of randomness so you don't always fight the same teams. And voila... HA becomes much more fun for everyone (except farmers, but I have no pity for them), and it requires minimal coding from ANet.

    You can also use the same in RA, TA, and other PvP forms. This code will also be great to have around for GW2.
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  9. #19
    GWOnline.Net Member BabyJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savsuds View Post
    BabyJ, the main problem is distinguishing between those willing to learn and those prepared to learn. The prepared have vent/TS/whatever and have used it before, UAX or close enough to play any desired role, know what every skill does and counters to them, Meta knowledge, etc. Most people, myself included lack the desire to train those willing to learn up to my level or the level of my friends (who I only play with). The prepared learner at least has done some of the work necessary so as not to be spoon fed during matches.
    Vent/TS - Check
    UAX - Check
    I cant say I know every single skill. I never got into dervs, para's and sins, but i don't think i would run into much of a problem in terms of countering them. Depending which roll I play as. I enjoy my monk, ele, and sometimes mes.

    I think much of my problem, I'm a shy type of person so i don't know people in game. Or at least enough of the right people to know. I guess 2 years ago instead of learning the game and how things work i should have been making friends. But like I've said before, not being in HA is not that big of deal to me. I would like to learn it but its not game breaking if I don't. I enjoy AB and when i need a real pick me up laugh i go to RA. I just know how hard it is for a new person in HA to try and learn. Instead of "HAHAHA" *emote spam* "NOOB"

    I agree there are a lot of new people that just want a cool emote to spam, but there are actually people that want to learn. So i could see where it would be hard to distinguish the ones that actually want to learn and the ones that are only there for bambi.

  10. #20
    GWOnline.Net Member mmorpg man's Avatar
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    in my experience there are 3 types of unranked players in HA. there are the small number of people who treat HA like AB and just want to "pawn" players because they're bored. then there's the people who are playing for competitiveness of HA and want to learn it properly. and finally we have the fame farmers who just want their emote to flash at people.

    you can usually identify each of these groups of players in a match. the 1st group usually just puts in random people (maybe even only 1 healer). the 2nd group usually tries getting into high ranked groups and ask for advice. and the third group can be identified by the use of builds like heroway.

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