Hi, just started playing GW, never played it seriously.. I want to learn PvP, and would like a quick rundown of profession roles.. I didnt realize how many profession combos people used until i did some observing of the GvG's. So I did some reading, and heard things like classes having certain roles in PvP, like getting kills or support. Essentially i wanted to play E/Mo because it sounded fun, but Now im wondering if any character with Monk in it would be considered a support class.. if which classes are which roles in pvp could be easily simplified, that would be great. Mainly I just want to play a good killing class, maybe one with some survivability if possible. hence my choice for E/Mo... Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.. tyvm!!
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19-10-2009, 08:30 #1
Trying to learn about PvP, can anyone give me a quick overview??
19-10-2009, 11:46 #2
Question, which games do you have access to?
Reccomendation, play some of the pve game to unlock things right away, and give you a better start in the game.
19-10-2009, 15:08 #3
GWOnline Site Pal Achievements:
- The Order of Dii [Dii]
There's too much to discuss here... but I do have three recommendations:
1) pvxwiki... it's not the bible, but it's a good start. Feel free to try builds from there, and to modify them, and to try new things entirely.
2) Play random PvP first, to get used to it. Random arena, Jade quarry, Fort aspenwood, and perhaps Alliance battles. When you're comfortable with your character in those styles, then move on to more structured styles.
3) Join a PvP Guild. There are PvP Guilds that accept new players and provide training. Just make sure to tell them that you are a new player.
19-10-2009, 17:19 #4
You asked for a breif Description so ill give my breif description of the best characters for pvp in my opinion.
The heart of the pvp group.
If the monk goes down the team suffers alot more than if any other team member dies, this means that monks often are both high priority targets and highly defended and hard-to-kill. In PvP the monk has 3 things to worry about besides not dying.
A: Stop red bars from going down. Pre protting your allies with the apropriate enchantments to prevent your allies from killing them. Guardian for people under melee pressure, Spirit bond or prot spirit on weaker armored targets to prevent spikes. Holy Veil to quickly remove dangerous hexes and make them easy to interrupt etc.
B: Push up red bars. You cant do with A alone, at some point or another, red bars will go down and it is your job to push them up again. Dont waste skill slots of stuff like Healing Breeze for regen, the healing takes time and is very meesly and not worth spending skill slots on.
C: Keep your team efficient. As a monk it is also your job to remove the various conditions and hexes that are hindering your team. Things such as backfire or diversion on your elementalist, cripple or blind on your warrior, or other nasty effects should be removed in order to keep your team killing the enemy. Remember to prioritise what you remove, so you dont waste your condition removal on removing poison from your elementalist while having blind sticking on your warrior.
The arms of the team. As a ranger you have alot of different jobs, you are a toolbox and can fit your play to various roles, offensive and defensive alike. Your job is to make sure your team gets the job done and that the enemy team doesnt. Your job as a ranger is:
A: Spread degeneration (i.e. poison from apply poison and bleeding from fx. Melanrus Shot) to as many foes as possible to provide pressure. Do not camp a single foe but work on wasting as much of the enemy monks energy as possible.
B: Interrupt. Work hard on mastering Savage shot and Distracting Shot. These serve a dual purpose as both defensive and offensive tools. DShotting enemy assassins or warriors while they are about to unleash a crapload of damage on a vulnerable character is a highly defensive act, whereas DShotting WoH on a monk is highly offensive. Discriminate between enemy skills and use savage shot for either followup interrupt or for shutting down long recharging skills such as Guardian, Rodgorts Invocation, Attunements, or Troll Ungent. Use Distracting Shot on key skills that are spammable such as Searing Flames, Dismiss Condition, Word of Healing, Blinding Flash etc.
C: Assist. Cripple enemy melees whenever you have the chance. Use Natural Stride to kite and cripple. Remember that once crippled you can ignore that melee for a while and change to a new target. Use Mending Touch to remove troublesome conditions from allies in need, especially Daze, Blind, Cripple and Deep Wound are high priority to remove, this takes pressure off your monk. Mending touch also serves to keep yourself unblinded. Assist Warrior, assassin, or elementalist in spikes using a high damage skill like ZShot.
The fists of the team. Your job is pretty simple, you kill stuff and make sure it dies. You can however also take on defensive roles such as linebacking.
A: Kill stuff. Spread Deep Wounds and damage foes to pressure and spike opposing teams. Work on wasting as much of the enemy monks energy on pre protting targets and then switch to someone more vulnerable. Dont stay on a protte target as you are wasting your time doign no good.
B: Knock down foes to prevent them from fleeing and activating skills. Work on Quaterknocking which will disable an opponent for a full 6 seconds while you bash in their face. Work on interrupting key skills to make your kills go through (see ranger interupts).
C: Movement. Make sure you can move fast to switch between targets and make sure that your enemy cant do it. Linebacking is a Defensive maneuver where you stay back and act as bodyguard for your monk, knocking down and interrupting enemy attacks on your monk, crippling opposing melees and generally keeping your monk from dying untill you can get back at killing.
The feet of the team. Your job is to kick and cripple. As an elementalist your main focus in pvp should be to cripple the enemy team using spells and hexes that lower their efficiency, similar to the reanger but packing more of a punch and being less assisting. In AB your main goal is also to cap shrines at a fast pace. Your job:
A: Keep melees and enemy interrupters from doing their job, using Blinding Flash/Surge, Blurred Vision, or water snares like Winters Embrace, Freezing Gust etc.
B: Knock down and spike vulnerable targets with Meteor, Mind Shock or equivalent. Pressure enemy monks with hexes and conditions of high priority and wasting energy on heavy prots.
The brain of the team. Make the other team loose. As a mesmer your job is to interrupt, disable and in any other way shut down the enemy team while making them vulnerable and assisting in spikes. Your job is:
A: Interrupt and mangle enemy spellcasters with Power Leak, Power Block and Power Drain. Remove defensive and offensive enchantments, especially key ones like guardian, spirit bond, attunements and equivalent.
B: Disable enemy skills. Blackout shines here and also works to drain enemy warriors of all adrenaline, this skill is both offensive and defensive and works as a Quaterknock without the impaired movement. Diversion is also a key skill that forces 6 seconds of inactivity, a cancelling of Holy Veil or wasting a skill for a long duration.
C: Slow and hinder the enemy using hexes that slow casting, movement or attacking, lowering enemy efficiency. Pressure in the form of damage and/or degeneration can also be added as a side effect.
Phew, that was quite alot. Oh well hope this helped.
19-10-2009, 18:38 #5
First off, by PvP I'm going to assume you mean GvG in particular.
In balanced GvG, though, we can be a little more specific about roles. First off, we'll assume that you're fighting 8v8 at the flagstand. That won't happen very long, but it's often how matches start and most of this is applicable over more of the match.
Frontline: Warriors, anyone else in melee. (Very rarely rangers, once in a while dervishes, once in a blue moon assassins). They apply damage where-ever it is most effective - usually among the caster classes, switching targets frequently as protection spells go up. Also participate in spikes. If your monks complain too much, you may want to switch to the enemy warriors - "linebacking" if your build allows it (crippling or KD) - sacrificing some of your damage to reduce the other team's damage.
Midline: Mesmers and Rangers. Complete utility characters. Usually target a monk who isn't the main target in a spike (or at least one of them does). Other then that they spread conditions/hexes and do their best to shut down the enemy monks and any other defense (blind ele, ward ele, enemy midline, etc).
Backline: Monks. Heal, prot, and pre-prot. Don't die.
Anyone else (ele, paragon, rit, necro) falls in the midline or backline or both depending on their exact role, and what they do is largely dictated by their build. Necros spread hexes and spike, ele's are usually providing some sort of defense for the rest of the backline, a paragon is probably mostly dealing damage and could even be considered frontline sometimes except for their position.
The Flagger: Usually an ele or a monk, they tend to be midline at this point in the game, but once either side caps the flagstand they spend half their time running flags and the other half helping their team.
Later in the game whichever team is losing will probably send 2-3 characters into the enemy base as a split while the other 5-6 fight the entire rest of the team. The hope with this is that the other team will either mishandle the split completely and lose, or that the opposing team loses more capability while fighting 3v3 + 5v5 then the team that started the split.
Especially when it comes to a split, remember what the goal in GvG is: kill the guild lord, or lacking that to deal the most damage to him before time runs out. That's important. If the other team suddenly loses 2 people and your team creams the remaining 6, pushing them steadily back to their GL... it doesn't matter, because those two who are suddenly missing are in *your* guild hall killing your lord opposed only by NPC's, and you just lost. 2 people against NPC's always wins faster then 8 people against 6 people and NPC's. (Well, as long as the 2 aren't incompetent.) This is the heart of why GvG is different then any other format - the goal. The first round of HA is pure deathmatch, as is all of TA and RA. There are no splits, there are no flaggers, so builds are different and as a result the whole thing is different. Later there are relics and capture points in HA, further changing the game... even 3 teams in the hall itself, adding another strategical layer in ethereal alliances.
Anything else you really will need to pick a profession/role (at least frontline/damage, midline/utility, or backline/defense) or better yet just join a casual GvG guild. There are plenty out there that don't really care about rating and just GvG as often as possible, if you just want to learn what GvG is like. Because the one thing I haven't really mentioned is communication. *Every* role needs to communicate what they're doing all the time. Warriors calling spike targets, midline saying when they manage to interrupt or disable important skills, monks making sure everyone knows when they're low on energy, plus at least one person calling out strategy.
19-10-2009, 18:43 #6
There's so much to GW pvp, I could talk for days and still not give a good overview. Aoi's done a pretty good job though giving you info about the classes which see the most use in pvp.
When I first decided I wanted to start learning, I lurked various pvp forums and started reading. There's some good topics around here on the various class forums, some stickied - others that you will have to dig for. Of course, this isn't the only forum to check out, but you will need patience to dig for the good info.
It wasn't just the classes I needed to learn about, but a lot of seemingly small things like how to set up the correct equipment, shield sets, runes and insignias - how to kite and how to try and avoid things like Bull's Strike and interrupts (I'm still terrible at doing this, by the way >_>), cancel casting, etc. I also made myself play classes I never imagined being able to play, like Monk and Mesmer. I firmly believe playing different classes other than your favored one gives you an advantage when it comes to facing that class in combat - you'll have a better idea of what to expect and what to do about it, and how to screw them over. So experiment with different roles.
Also, start watching Observer Mode. There's a couple of guilds I try and watch whenever I see them up there, and it's just because I like how they do things. There's also the big name guilds to watch out for - follow whichever class you're trying to learn about and see how the act and react in various situations. It might not make sense at first, but I promise it will start to sink in. Eventually you'll probably start to pick up when players are being very good or very bad too, and you can pick up tricks like this also.
Be prepared to basically forget what you might have learned about the classes in PvE. PvP is very team oriented - you don't just go out and kill stuff. There's a lot to think about at all times, and the aim isn't always to just 'lolpwn' the enemy. Best of luck. :)Dea Draconis • Friendship is Magic • Dea Felidae
21-10-2009, 23:21 #7
For obs mode: Stealing Society [StS] is good to watch, Under Pressure [uP] and I like watching I Disposable Heroes I [DirT], too.
For specific classes you'd have to find someone more knowledgeable than me, though. I know Farin Fencehopper from [uP] is a good warrior, and that The Champ Is Here is a good ranger (I completely forgot what guild he's in? uP?)
Also check out Team Quitter's http://www.teamquitter.com/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=128PvP section.
By the way, why do people run monks as flaggers these days?
Last edited by Mini Me; 22-10-2009 at 10:33.
21-10-2009, 23:40 #8
By the way, why do people run monks as flaggers these days?
22-10-2009, 00:32 #9
Monk flaggers can stay alive against triple ele splits quite well, and much better than rits can.
And they don't get soloed by IoP.