Not another "ten reasons to play"-video

[Sagelikeone]

I didn't want to make a top ten reasons-video. There are loads of those. But I did want to make this.

[sorudo]

with already a mistake without even watching the video, GW2 isn't free to play, it's buy to play.

[Alaris]

That's a common community misnomer, not something we can blame Sagelikeone for.

Good video.

[Sagelikeone]

It is fixed with a annotation, as I was accentuating, not technically ignorant. My apologies. I am glad someone on the internet is willing ti point out the flaws in the things you make though. :)

[Art]

Yes those rare people out there somewhere on this vast old internetz who point things out - you were so lucky to find one of them Sage!



-Art

[Shrandar]

Some more pointing out:

I gather you have grown sick and tired of the 'WoW formula' which is fine, but tbh a lot of your reasosns for GW2 being better, hinges on you being tired of it. Aka: treadmills are terrible, timesinks are terrible, dailies are terrible and GW2 doesnt have any of that so its better. Not a very convincing argument, to me at least. You will probably get the ones along that already feel the same way as you do but thats a bit like preaching to the choir.

Another point: you make the connection between p2p and elements like timesinks and treadmills as if the one undoubtedly causes the other. Frankly I am not so convinced the one always leads to the other and that the reason why there are raids, dailies and the lot are purely to keep people subscribed. I can think of a some different reasons, game-design wise, to implement these. Also the upcomming MMO from Funcom (The Secret World) seems to get rid of a lot of these so called standards and will still be p2p.

Related to this I think that stating that GW2 won't have the longetivity of a game like WoW will not pull people to your side. Sure if you all make them out to be 'grind lovers' then its an argument you have won before you have even begun to make it. However I think that a lot of people actually enjoy the raids in WoW for the challenge, the social experience and yes also the loot rewards. Blizzard has arguably a lot of very nicely designed dungeons and raids that can keep pople occupied for the sheer fun of experiencing and mastering them. GW2 yet has to prove how it will deal with the 'end-game' issue as it will inevitably crop up, also for them. All I am saying is that you cannot just dismiss the concern regarding 'end-game' by calling the people in question 'grind lovers'.


Overall I feel that you paint a very generalised and predjudiced picture of the "WoW MMO" which imo serves litle else then to show how much you grew tired of them. An 'at random' connection between them being p2p and their content on top of slightly insulting references to the ones that like playing those MMO's (grind-lovers, indoctrinated by the cult of the question mark) makes me genuinly doubt you will get your message across.

[Sagelikeone]

Some more pointing out:

You will probably get the ones along that already feel the same way as you do but thats a bit like preaching to the choir.

I don't mind. Really, I don't. I made this to voice how I feel about the game, to note the links I see between business practice/intent and gameplay, not to "convert" anyone. If that had been my intent I think I would have just linked Alex's video. It is loads better anyway.

[Alaris]

(...)

Some more pointing out of my own.

I have no issue with people enjoying a game because they are having fun playing it, and yes, I have met a lot of people who enjoy the grind in WoW. That is fine, and I respect that. I can too enjoy grind in many games that I do play. However, the case can nevertheless be made about WoW wasting your time in so many ways. You could steamline WoW, and only make the game better.

Here's a few examples:
1) Add a skip button while on griffons, so that instead of watching the whole flight, you instantly warp at your destination.
2) Add an option so that crafting etc does not involve a progress bar, especially for multiple objects. Even if skipping the bar means you pay a small fee.
3) Add more ways to skip early content for those players who want to start at WotLK or get to endgame sooner, i.e. don't care for grinding their way up.

Timesinks and treadmills are not caused by subscription, they are caused by game companies that realize that said treadmills and timesinks are a cheap way to keep players paying their subscription longer. A large number of players leave games behind once they finish them. I don't know much about Secret World, admittedly, but it is possible that they are trying to make a sub game without time-wasting, and if so I wish them good luck... it's about time game companies started taking risks that show respect to consumers.

GW2 will have longevity imo for the right reasons. They give you reasons to replay with different characters so you can experience their storyline, and reasons to revisit old areas because you scale your level (so it's not trivial) and you might have missed a bunch of DE's. Likewise, dungeons have 3 or 4 (I forget) different events that can happen randomly, so it will take you a few runs through to experience them all. More even if you want the gear from it.

The main difference is that none of this is manditory, you get to level up and have fun in whichever way you want. Compare that to WoW where I quit during the grinding phase at level 45 even though I really wanted to try the endgame instances. Mid-game instances were ok, but not quite what I was hyped to believe I could find at endgame.

[Shrandar]

(...)

Lol, my response ended up being so long I decided to post it as a blog, you can find it here http://guildwars.incgamers.com/forum...php?5484-Grind

[raspberry jam]

That video was more about why to not play WoW than it was about why to play GW2.
But I liked it, good analysis of grind and how brainwashing players by making them get used to repetitive action works.

Nitpick: there are 5 dailies in GW1, 4 in post searing (Zaishen Mission, Bounty, Vanquish and Battle) and one in pre. There are also many many repeatable quests.