So, want to see what's in the cash shop?

[sorudo]

there is a difference between whining and preventing a big mistake, they will make a big mistake if not a huge mistake if they add any sort of buff, grab bag or lotto item being sold in the store.
GW1 has such a good reputation with there store because nothing in it gives you any advantage at all, it seems Anet looks way to much to other stores and are forgetting the real goal.
cryptic made this mistake and all of the games are now all pay to win games, lotro did it but on a relatively good way but still it's bad the buffs exist.
better yet, look at all the games with a store, every time there is a store with buffs or other advantage crap the game just suffers under it.

they should look at the real problem here, GW1 has it perfect and they should never ever do anything other then what GW1 has achieved.
the deal is really simple, ether keep the store as good as GW1 has it or suffer the consequences.

[Nemeon Lion]

Hhhmmm....

Anet said that you can get max level armor and items quickly once you reach level 80.

HEY GUYS I HAZ A CRAZY IDEA!!

Don't buy loot bags. Simple.

SAY WHA???

[sorudo]

exactly, ones you reach lvl 80.
in the mean time plenty of ppl buy XP buffs and other ridicules things, it's really not that simple when you think it trough.

[Nemeon Lion]

exactly, ones you reach lvl 80.
in the mean time plenty of ppl buy XP buffs and other ridicules things, it's really not that simple when you think it trough.

And why is that a problem?

XP buff only works on kills. Guess what's more efficient, doing dynamic events or grinding mobs?

Crafting buff only increases the ammount of exp you receive from crafting, not the quality of the crafted item. Why is that a problem?

The only buff I can see people having concerns with is really the karma buff, since karma is supposed to be the "fair and hard" to obtain currency. Other then that I don't see how buffs should be a concern when they really don't affect your character capability to kill stuff.

[The King of Dust]

Not quite exact, as increased XP will lead to you character getting better more quickly. Same for Crafting buff, earning XP more quickly means it takes you less time to be able to craft nicer stuff. Looking at the numbers, it might be negligible, but when I judge a system, I try to look at it taken to the extreme and see if it's flawed that way. Programmer habit.

Still, as they're obtainable without using real-money, the buffs themselves aren't that bad. I still hate them (I hate cons in GW1 too), but my main gripe is that these things are available for real-money. I don't think any advantage, no matter how small, should be available through real-money. That's my ideal anyway. Hard to reach, since if you release an expansion, it's bound to come with a few advantages, and giving it for free just doesn't work. But as much as possible, micro-transactions should stick to untradeable cosmetic stuff and account services, and there shouldn't be any RMT system (because there's no point in not having buffs in the store if you can just change real-money for in-game currency to get buffs). GW1 had no problems staying afloat with just that, and GW2 has gathered a lot more attention. Anet doesn't need this crap in their store to make profits, and the player community would be better off without them.

Edit:
Plus, when you think about it for a few seconds, either their effect is too small to be worth the price, or they do have an effect that can be felt and thus are problematic. In the first scenario, there's no point in having them in the store, and in the second scenario, it's better if they're not in the store.

[sorudo]

And why is that a problem?

XP buff only works on kills. Guess what's more efficient, doing dynamic events or grinding mobs?

Crafting buff only increases the ammount of exp you receive from crafting, not the quality of the crafted item. Why is that a problem?

The only buff I can see people having concerns with is really the karma buff, since karma is supposed to be the "fair and hard" to obtain currency. Other then that I don't see how buffs should be a concern when they really don't affect your character capability to kill stuff.

it effects the overall game-play and thus hurts the game, when you can finish the game 2X faster guess what will happen.
ppl start to complain that the game is to easy, you out-level places way faster then in normal play and you end up with a ton of threads full of whiners complaining because the game is to short and that they need more stuff to do.

when you don't allow any acceleration buffs it will keep the game from falling apart, players play the game at a normal rate and the devs have more time to make new content before ppl ask for more.
btw, would you like it when you can get to lvl 30 within a day?
i dunno about you but i rather play around a week to achieve that, it makes playing the game and reaching lvl 30 much more enjoyable.

[Nemeon Lion]

it effects the overall game-play and thus hurts the game, when you can finish the game 2X faster guess what will happen.
ppl start to complain that the game is to easy, you out-level places way faster then in normal play and you end up with a ton of threads full of whiners complaining because the game is to short and that they need more stuff to do.

Stop being ridiculous. The buffs don't allow you to finish the game 2x faster. And you shouldn't care if people complain the game is too short when they themselves made the game shorter.

Also, who cares if people can level faster? There are people who are gonna level faster then you, no matter what. This is nothing new. The game should be balanced for max level. Exp buffs don't affect this balance since they become useless once you hit max level.

Also, why are people so focused on the level? We already know that your job is not to level but to experience content. Does someone with a 10% increased exp on kills really affect your enjoyement? Really?

Cry me a bloody river. There's so much to complain about this item shop and you guys complain about the only thing in there that really doesn't make a difference.

[The King of Dust]

Yes, there's much worse in the shop, like the lotto items, keys and rez orbs. Just wanted to chime in regarding the "don't affect your character capability to kill stuff." part. They do, temporarily and not much, but they do. I agree that they aren't the real issue though. The core of the problem is the change in Anet's philosophy regarding micro-transactions, and the biggest symptom is RMT.

[Lady Rhonwyn]

Yes, there's much worse in the shop, like the lotto items, keys and rez orbs. Just wanted to chime in regarding the "don't affect your character capability to kill stuff." part. They do, temporarily and not much, but they do. I agree that they aren't the real issue though. The core of the problem is the change in Anet's philosophy regarding micro-transactions, and the biggest symptom is RMT.

How do they affect your characters capability to kill stuff? Remember, all areas are scaled, which means you character will be scaled back if you're too high a level for your current location...

We had XP scrolls from the start in GW1. Did you use them while going from Ascalon to the Jungle? Or to gain XP for skill points? I know the only time I used scrolls is when I had a DP and wanted to get rid of it faster...

About that res orb, everybody's got a res, right? So, the only location that that would be useful, is when you're hunting out there, all alone, with nobody around, while you're far away from the nearest res point. It's not a mass res: "Revives you from death once" so it won't be of a lot of use in a party situation where there are people around who can res you.

[Shrandar]

Hhhmmm....

Anet said that you can get max level armor and items quickly once you reach level 80.

HEY GUYS I HAZ A CRAZY IDEA!!

Don't buy loot bags. Simple.

SAY WHA???

I have another crazy idea:

Why not take them out of the cash shop alltogether? Simple.


Seriously though, based on the current info we have on the game I don't really see why they are in there. As you said, getting max armor and weapons should be relatively painless, so why have the lootbags in the first place? If getting armor would be hard then having a lootbag could give a significant advantage but this would be contrary to Anet's philosophy. If it is only to get a special skin then why just not sell seperate skins (like the costumes) at least people would know what they were getting. The only remotely 'understandable' reason I could come up with is to feed the economy with random items so as to create diversity, but this is really stretching it as the same could be achieved ingame by tweaking drop-rates.

That leaves us with Anet wanting to make money. No suprises there. But as I said in my previous post, there is a difference between making money and milking players. While for the personal experience not buying anything from the cash shop you dont agree with might be a solution (assuming indeed that the game is fully playable in and out of itself) this doesnt remove the simple fact that the items are there and exist solely to get money from the (other) players. As an idea I dont like this, nomatter if I buy them or not. Now again, the cash shop contents as we have seen em might be heavily influenced by the beta, so I am reserving judgement untill an explanatory post or release.


The buffs I do not really have an issue with as imo they fall purely into the convenience section. There will always be people who want to level faster be it only to see that level 80 dungeon or do the high end content. If they enjoy it that way, more power to them. With the scaling in place there is no way for them to grief low level players anyway so both sides win. The crafting xp imo is not an alltogether bad thing either, if I reach level 80 and change my craft skill, a way to get to the good items faster without having to grind through the low level stuff first could be nice. The karma buff is maybe a bit iffy (considering the rewards) but that all depends on balancing, likewise with the influence buff.