GW2 Skill System Revamp

[CaptinSupreem]

I was lucky enough to have friends IRL that played, so partying in GW1 was only ever a problem towards the end when people stopped playing. But by then I was doing desert tours for free and soloing HM for lockpicks and such (I was never a leet player). I had four copies of the game (I bought four keys) so friends dropping in could play, and I also bought extra character slots to build from extra classes. Builds were my thing. Maybe I was just a little bit addicted :)

Hey, GW2 is not a bad game. I just wonder if the skill system will last the distance. But you guys have said your piece, and it is unanimously that GW2 is fine the way it is.

Thanks for not flaming me for a different opinion, it reflects very well on these forums.

[Fluffball]

The game, in my experience so far, rewards individualism. It doesn't punish teamwork, mind you; it just gives a lot of incentive to be "independent". It's hard to get people to help out in a party-sense because everyone wants to go off and do their own thing--get their own daily achievements, map their own POIs, do their own heart quests--the incentive for team work is rarely present outside of puzzles and dungeons. Yes, random strangers who happen to have the same momentary goal as you will pass by and help; but it rarely turns into a "monogamous" team relationship. More like a series of ships passing in the night..

Do you ask people to join your party? I rarely have to wait more than a few seconds to find someone else who wants to join me on whatever I'm doing. Last night I just said "hey, I'm 100 percenting this map, does anyone want to join." And a few seconds later I was in a party that lasted for an hour or two.

[Barinthus]

Guess I have truly bad luck when it comes to partying :) it's nice that i can solo but sometimes its fun to be a part of a party. Cant wait to try the first dungeon!

[Tsukasa Kusanagi]

Guess I have truly bad luck when it comes to partying :) it's nice that i can solo but sometimes its fun to be a part of a party. Cant wait to try the first dungeon!

Please, please, please: just wait and do CM instead of AC first. You may not want to kill yourself after CM.

I'm curious how expansions (or campaigns or however they wish to spin it) will work to "expand" the game play for the current classes. More weapons? I think this is the idea I got from the OP's post, and in that sense, I am interested to see how things play out.

[Arcanum]

I actually like both systems :)

To start with: I liked it that in GW1 it was possible to make viable builds out of everything (to some extend) and it left a lot of room for creativity. Things like we run in our XM teams are things you'd never see in GW2. For example we have dervs as main damagers, but they're wielding a staff and are using Necrosis and Shouts while being permanently spell immune and can turn themselves into an absolutely epic tank when needed.

But on the other hand, there was a reason why people were calling it "Build Wars" at some point. Especially in PvP or in the higher end zones. It was "bring this or be kicked" and certain builds ruled in the PvP-world. You saw them on obs-mode and then everyone and their dog was running it until something else became the "new hype".

Then GW2 comes along with this new system and I must say that I also like that. Sure we get somewhat less options due to limited weapons and fixed bars. But I don't mind that. The dynamic combat and switching mid combat is awesome. Also the fact that whenever you're not in combat but still in the zone, you can change everything (well ok, not traits). Try doing that in GW1 ;-).

[Alaris]

There's the risk that with traits and swap and all that, we'll have build wars later on too, especially in PvP and dungeons. The game is too fresh, people don't know what they are doing, we don't know how it will become.

However, it's much more intuitive to put a working build together that actually gets the job done, so at least for casuals, the system is a lot better.

[Cyberman]

You do realize that if they did let us choose our weapons skills like you are suggesting, 50% of them will NEVER be used.

How do you know that? I'm not saying they should repeat what they did in GW1, that was obviously wrong.
But we're not binary and currently it looks as if GW2 skills is the opposite of GW1 skills. There must be a sensible in-between.
Even if those additional skills weren't used, I'd argue that having the option to use them would make things go down smoother - it'll reduce friction.

I agree more options would be good, but keep in mind that they will be adding skills and weapons in expansions.

Which doesn't change the "problem" I have with the system. It still doesn't really give you options, unless these skills are not tied to weapons.

A small pool of skills is much, much better than 10, 20, 50 skills.

Problem is, I don't see the current system as a "pool of skills". It's a "pool of weapons" that have inherent skills.
A small but to me important difference.

So really, when I hear that my first 5 skills are set, I think the argument misses out the fact that I have a full 48 different ways to configure those skills.

And to me that misses out that these 48 ways to configure the skills really mean that I only have several weapons to choose from.

I'm not sure how to best explain - but what bothers me is that apparently no matter how I chose, something is forced down my throat.
If I want to use skill X, I have to take weapon Y.
If I want to use weapon A, I have to use skill B.
What if I want to use weapon A and skill X? Unless transmutation stones actually allow this: No dice. The system knows best, just nod and smile.

Even if transmutation can solve that, it'll still feel forced. Less so, though.

[Viti Ligo]

I can live with the current skill system GW2 has but I am not it's greatest fan boy. It's just... I feel like traits are totally uninteresting way to tweak my build.

[Alaris]

@Cyberman:

Transmutation stones don't allow this. Weapons do make some choices for you. I'm not always happy with the choices ANet makes for me, for example, guardian greatsword skill #5 I never use... but it's still a good system.

The problem as I see it is that you're not seeing the system for its qualities, but rather judging it compared to what you want. And you don't really care that what you want is flawed. Which, in a way, is fine.

[Egg Shennn]

@Cyberman:

Transmutation stones don't allow this. Weapons do make some choices for you. I'm not always happy with the choices ANet makes for me, for example, guardian greatsword skill #5 I never use... but it's still a good system.

Really? I've been finding it really useful, pulling the foes in with #5 then #2 and #3...

But on the topic, I probably did more build crafting than most dozen players combined, and I did love that in GW1. But, the system in GW2 fits the goal of the game. I think the OP seriously underestimates the value of game balance and how difficult maintaining that balance would be with GW1 numbers of skills. Yes, I'd love if we had a couple options of skills we could unlock that gave some variation on each weapon, but not at the risk of imbalance in the game. As is, I would expect if they want to add in skills, there will be additional weapons added, which would allow some more choice, but still make maintaining balance realistic.

Solo farmers are game breakers that turn a game economy into a joke. I'm happy without that.